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Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness
#61
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness
(August 24, 2015 at 7:14 pm)Rhythm Wrote:
(August 24, 2015 at 6:59 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: I don't think it's necessarily the case that being aware implies being conscious.  Consciousness is, if nothing else, a bundle of functions that creates a construct which in humans we call the conscious mind.   This is to deny that our perceptions just pipe themselves to an aware center; that center is an illusion created by the construct.  What ties it all together then?  We don't currently know, but I think it would be a mistake to conclude that animals that behave as though they are aware are necessarily conscious.  I suspect that consciousness is a specific set of behaviors that arose after the ability to be aware of one's environment and respond to it.

I think that it does, though, obviously I don't think that response implies self awareness or anything even remotely close to human consciousness.  I think that if we explored the idea that response does not imply awareness, for example, you'd have to make staggering number of special considerations - similarly, that awareness does not imply consciousness.  Perhaps you're right, it would be unfortunate for knowledge if you were, though, imo...lol.  I think that maybe you have greater requirements for consciousness that we don't share (and whatever it is you call the bar for consciousness I probably have a different term in mind for, but a similar idea).  I'm willing to accept that awareness is the bare minimum.  If something is aware, if it presents an effect which we attribute to awareness, I'll call it conscious - though that doesn't really move the chains very far for me.

In the phenomena of blind-sight, people can be aware of stimulus in their visual field without being conscious of seeing something. I think this is a strong indication that there is a disconnect between consciousness and simply being aware. Another example where there appears to be awareness without consciousness is the alien hand syndrome in which one's off hand acts as if it had a mind of its own. And perhaps it does. What there is little evidence of as yet however is the idea that it has a consciousness of its own. It appears entirely possible to be aware without being conscious. Other examples include sleep walking and split brain subjects. I think there is sufficient evidence to posit that consciousness is something other than simple awareness. Humans are aware, but only when consciousness directs its attention towards something. Aside from that, we are aware without being conscious of what we are aware of. A phenomenon amply demonstrated by change blindness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkrrVozZR2c
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Messages In This Thread
Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 24, 2015 at 2:52 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Grandizer - August 24, 2015 at 3:44 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 24, 2015 at 6:59 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 24, 2015 at 3:54 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 24, 2015 at 4:21 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Brian37 - August 24, 2015 at 4:03 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 24, 2015 at 4:58 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by abaris - August 24, 2015 at 5:58 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by IATIA - August 28, 2015 at 9:38 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 28, 2015 at 9:56 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 24, 2015 at 4:51 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Brian37 - August 24, 2015 at 4:52 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 24, 2015 at 5:36 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 24, 2015 at 6:57 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Mudhammam - August 24, 2015 at 5:03 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 24, 2015 at 5:09 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 24, 2015 at 7:26 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 24, 2015 at 10:50 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 24, 2015 at 11:17 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 25, 2015 at 10:59 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 24, 2015 at 5:22 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 24, 2015 at 6:06 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Mudhammam - August 24, 2015 at 5:50 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by vorlon13 - August 24, 2015 at 5:57 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 24, 2015 at 6:07 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 24, 2015 at 6:25 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Angrboda - August 24, 2015 at 6:59 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Little lunch - August 24, 2015 at 6:54 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Little lunch - August 24, 2015 at 6:57 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Foxaèr - August 24, 2015 at 7:02 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 24, 2015 at 7:07 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Mudhammam - August 24, 2015 at 8:33 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Foxaèr - August 24, 2015 at 8:34 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Pizza - August 24, 2015 at 9:08 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Foxaèr - August 24, 2015 at 9:14 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Pizza - August 24, 2015 at 10:08 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Foxaèr - August 24, 2015 at 10:10 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Mudhammam - August 25, 2015 at 12:05 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Foxaèr - August 25, 2015 at 12:11 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Mudhammam - August 25, 2015 at 12:22 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 24, 2015 at 9:01 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Angrboda - August 25, 2015 at 12:30 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 24, 2015 at 9:27 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 24, 2015 at 9:23 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by robvalue - August 25, 2015 at 2:46 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 25, 2015 at 10:03 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 26, 2015 at 12:35 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 25, 2015 at 11:15 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 25, 2015 at 11:21 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 25, 2015 at 3:16 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 25, 2015 at 5:58 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 25, 2015 at 7:51 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 25, 2015 at 8:02 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 11:12 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by robvalue - August 25, 2015 at 3:29 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 25, 2015 at 7:21 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by robvalue - August 26, 2015 at 1:51 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 11:06 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 26, 2015 at 11:10 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 26, 2015 at 3:31 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 25, 2015 at 4:28 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 25, 2015 at 7:41 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 25, 2015 at 7:59 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 26, 2015 at 9:06 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 12:29 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 26, 2015 at 11:22 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 12:51 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 1:16 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 1:25 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 26, 2015 at 1:50 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 3:12 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 3:10 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 26, 2015 at 3:07 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 3:23 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 4:17 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 5:56 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 26, 2015 at 7:16 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 26, 2015 at 8:14 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Whateverist - August 26, 2015 at 9:16 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by brewer - August 26, 2015 at 9:38 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 26, 2015 at 10:21 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 27, 2015 at 2:10 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 27, 2015 at 2:32 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by robvalue - August 27, 2015 at 2:49 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 27, 2015 at 11:39 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Ben Davis - August 27, 2015 at 8:41 am
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Rhondazvous - August 27, 2015 at 1:08 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 27, 2015 at 8:01 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 27, 2015 at 10:10 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 27, 2015 at 11:19 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Angrboda - August 28, 2015 at 5:25 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by Angrboda - August 28, 2015 at 4:51 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 28, 2015 at 9:31 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 28, 2015 at 9:40 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by IATIA - August 28, 2015 at 9:45 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by IATIA - August 28, 2015 at 10:08 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by AFTT47 - August 28, 2015 at 10:21 pm
RE: Sam Harris On Defining Consciousness - by bennyboy - August 28, 2015 at 11:46 pm

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