Why More Americans Want to Own Guns

[Ben Davis]

Hey Rhythm,

The mainstream culture of ownership is not responsible for gun crime in the states, and mass shootings are an infinitesimal portion of our gun problem.

I was only talking about gun-related deaths. The higher the rate of gun ownership, the higher the rate of gun-related deaths. I mentioned Australian mass shooting stats as they're a good attention-grabber but it should be noted that gun-related deaths, period, have plummeted since the 1996 changes to their gun control legislation.

If you want to measure whats causal, let's do so.  Six of ten gun deaths are suicides, the rate of suicide is increasing while the rate of homocide is decreasing. The remaining four are inextricably linked to our war on drugs.

Are accidents not responsible for any? I think you have a hole in your stats there. Although I wouldn't be surprised if suicide was the most common category of gun-related death in the US; access to guns would provide a quicker, less painful alternative to non-prescription drug overdoses, hanging, slit wrists or falling (the European favourites). But I get your point, suicide is not combatted effectively by gun controls, neither are murder rates. Both of those are better managed with approaches like managing poverty, wage inequality, education, unemployment and other 'social health' factors. As for the war on drugs, you'll get no argument from me there; it's a concept failure, responsible for much harm and almost no good.

Contextually, the vast majority of guns and gun owners are concentrated in rural areas which have statistically low rates of gun crime (and violent crime overall).  The vast majority of guns and gun owners will never be involved in either a homocide or a suicide.

Indeed, the same is true here in the UK. I happen to live in Norfolk which, due to a largely rural community, has one of the highest rates of gun ownership, higher even than estimates of illegal gun ownership in some of the worst inner-city, crime-ridden parts of the country (although it's worth noting that those rates are still really low compared to the US). But no matter the majority impacts, wherever there's gun ownership, there are rates of gun-related deaths. The most effective way to combat those is with well-thought-out controls.

Any law we pass will effect that greater number, and almost by definition will not effect the other - they've already shown they're willing to break the law.

I'd suggest that's not strictly true. In the UK, controls have reduced the number of illegal guns by making them scarce thus expensive. Most criminals can't afford guns. If guns were to become similarly scarce in the US, I'd be surprised if that simple law of economics would fail. Additionally, a crucial part of the UK controls is that most police don't carry guns so there's no 'arms race' pressure between criminals and authorities.

With respect, the history of the UK and the history of the US have produced vastly different cultures. The guns have always been with us. We didn't suddenly become incompetent.

Indeed. But I'm not suggesting 'incompetence', I'm simply stating the basic fact that higher rates of gun ownership = higher rates of gun-related death. In terms of the 'culture of gun ownership', I'd suggest that if the US had a century-long break from gun ownership, like the UK, it would pretty much vanish.

Barring that one little cops vs robbers spike in the data, our murder rate is moving in the direction we want it to.  IMO, addressing the war on drugs directly will do more to reduce gun crime than any gun restrictions or bans ever could, and it will also decrease the rate of violent crime overall.  It would also be far easier to accomplish than any challenge to the 2nd amendment, while...likely, saving us a great deal of money.  If we wanted to address the -greater- , but admittedly less sexy portion of gun death, wider access to better mental health services is probably going to be the most effective approach.  Bet we'd catch some mass shooters in that net too.

I completely agree with that.