Without citing the bible, what marks the bible as the one book with God's message?

[ronedee]

But, at least you have a stationary target. I do not....because every Atheist has his own "non" belief system.

There's no such thing as a 'non-belief system'. There's nothing systemic about not believing. There are no rules to follow, no rituals to undertake, and no organization which claims to speak for us. Anything I, Zen Badger, Faith No More or any of the rest of us have in common beyond not believing in gods is completely coincidental.

This is easy for you to say! But it is true that there is NO formula besides the fact of "non-belief". Anything goes after that actually! And you purposely missed my point. As Christians we are on the same page.

That's what makes it hard to communicate with Atheists! We have to first figure out what form of hate they have. Just look at all the different replies I get! And each one of you disects my statements differently!

I do not hate God because God is a fiction, though I often make arguments with the assumption that he is real. If God was real, I would most certainly hate him, and I'll save you the trouble of figuring out why: the God in your bible is a worse, more pervasive, more destructive evil than any other mankind has yet to invent. He demonstrates every single one of humanity's worst, most heinous criminal traits, while almost never demonstrating any of humanity's better ones. The world is bad enough when it's only filled with people who think he's real. If he actually was, human existence would be one stagnant, endless nightmare of spiritual slavery to a being which is depicted as reveling in bloodshed and misery. You can tell who hasn't read the Bible, ever; they're the ones who think Jesus is your bud and wants to play hockey with your kids.

What are you talking about?! Some....most...here....have said that "men" wrote the bible! So.... has God, if He does exist really weighed in on anything personally? Only through men! And that can be tanited as we've learned.

And you can't be talking about the Gospel, in the Bible! That message is very clear!! LOVE is the message.

Also, most of those who do believe in God are not making the most trouble in the world....at least not the ones who believe in Christianity!

Christians in America are, as a group, responsible for much of the reparable ills in America, which has ripple effects on the entire world (many of them negative). Of course, other faiths like Islam are even worse and more actively threatening to humanity, but I wonder how gay people in Uganda feel now that their government, with the blessings of Christian leaders (and the churches) are about to unleash completely legal genocide upon them.

And, if there's one thing the Bible teaches us, it is that God has a real hardon for genocide.

Again the "old testament", which is about Law. I wasn't there, so I can't comment on what happened, and why. It could all be just a "story" as many A's say it is!

The Gospel is the important section of the Bible. And do Christians in Uganda, or anywhere follow Jesus' Word to the letter? NO!!

So again, what "man" does is what man does. Blame it on just about any reason you'd like! Or any religion you'd like! Are there more Atheist killers than Christian killers? Recently there are! But I won't consider YOU in that group of nutz!

And again...God hasn't said much to us about why! But if you did believe as I do that He exists...I'm sure He will have the answers. After all...He is God!

"For My thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways My ways, saith the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways, and My thoughts than your thoughts."

So we are constantly on the parallels of our existance, you and I. There is no common ground because it's about what you see. I can respect that in certain ways.

Unfortunately, I won't recieve that respect back. Because there is nothing inside besides a pumping heart, and a ticking brain that refuses anything other than its own purpose.

But wait! There is LOVE! For friends, family, a new baby! And all that is GOOD.

But wait again! You can't see Love... at least it's make-up in our pysche.....You need to find it, and to feel it, and give it, to actually receive it. Hmmmmm

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I have an open mind when it comes to ideas, for and against my beliefs. If for anything...to at least fortify them! I just don't understand the logic in lashing out that most of you take?

Well, don't reply to the ones you feel are lashing out. I can only speak for myself, but there has been no hostility from me in this thread. I have simply asked you questions about the implications of your statements. Your rant, however, makes me think that you are only focusing on negativity and ignoring any attempt at a reasonable conversation.

All I would like to know is how do you fit the fact that people can be happy without faith into your beliefs.

OK! I'll take your advice!

And, I don't think that people need faith to be happy!

I think they need faith to be saved!

You and others think we as Christians are "fooling ourselves". Well, I know a lot of happy fools!

And every person I know that has a close relationship with God has Hope, even in the face of disaster!

"Everything works for Good, for those that Love the Lord."

I'm certain they are out there somewhere....but I don't know a lot of happy people w/o God. Some in my own family! And NOT necessarily the Atheists!

And you won't find me making that mistake again!