RE: Miracle
September 2, 2015 at 5:13 pm
(This post was last modified: September 2, 2015 at 5:48 pm by ReptilianPeon.)
Ignoring that bigot accusation...
You claim there is consensus, but there is not. According to Abdur Raheem Green, a well known Fascist and Da'i, people who claim that you can use Meccan prayer times (if you do not live in Mecca) "should not be taken seriously" and "there is no basis for this claim":
At 44:40 in the video, during the question and answer portion.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANG6q50OvoA
So, in the words of one of the best known Da'i, Harris talking rubbish... See, nobody can agree on how to interpret the Quran and Hadith, hence we have different Jurisprudence and denominations. Allah did not tell humans whose Quran interpretation is the right one.
In regard to embryology, Keith Moore is a loon. Nothing more to add. He is an opportunist and he has been given lots of fake awards and titles by Dawah sites in order to make him appear like a more important scientist than he actually is.
Anyhow you can find videos in this handy playlist I have linked, where most of the scientists who attended the conference at King Abdulaziz University inform watchers that they were deceived and quote mined. None of the scientists who attended the Shiekh's conference actually believe the Quran is miraculous. Keith Moor is absent because he is a noob.
Top scientists comment on the Quran YouTube Playlist
Featuring:
William Hay
Alfred Kroner
Tom Armstrong
Pete Palmer
Who explain how they were deceived by the Saudis.
The Quran is making a claim that Mecca is really old and we'd expect that if people have been going on pilgrimage there for thousands of years, like the Quran claims, we'd see evidence, such as human belongings or bodies (e.g. a burial site). I'm not asking for evidence for individual people, but of a trend of going for pilgrimage to Mecca between the time of Abraham and the time of Muhammad.
I can go further. The Quran also claims "waves the size of mountains" in relation to Noah's flood, suggesting it was global:
11:42
"So the Ark floated with them on the waves (towering) like mountains, and Noah called out to his son, who had separated himself (from the rest): "O my son! embark with us, and be not with the unbelievers!"
Yet civilizations in Arabia at the time of the supposed flood continue as normal, as if the flood had never happened. Some claim it was a local flood described in the Quran, but just how local is "local"? Local is a purely subjective term which means different things to different people. If it was local then people could simply avoid the flood.
But wasn't the intention of the flood Allah being upset at flawed creation? So Allah took away the free will of the flood victims and then after the flood let the world return to its flawed state. What a waste of human life! Speaking of Allah hating people, Allah must really hate all the starving Africans:
39:52 "Know they not that Allah enlarges the provision or restricts it, for any He pleases? Verily, in this are Signs for those who believe!"
Why doesn't Allah give everyone the food they require instead of hurting them? But of course, it doesn't actually matter if people are starving because we will hopefully seem them in Jannah. Life is just a temporary state before Jannah, so it doesn't matter if there are wars or hunger.
In regard to Spirit of Allah, how did you determine that the translators you listed had a better understanding than that Abdullah Yusuf Ali? We can both play this game. I could list Quran translators that suit my argument at the time, but I chose to remain consistent and always use Abdullah Yusuf Ali.
Regardless, there is no way am I using Sahih International. It's really dishonest translation, as I showed, here, in the topic titled "Newer Quran translations". It's a post science in the Quran narrative translation, hence the Saudis have translated it with certain biases. I'm not going to take a translation that forces the word "sperm" into the text of the Quran seriously.
And the others are just obscure translations. And Muhsin Khan translation was sponsored by the Saudi establishment, who obviously have and agenda and want to continue what Abdul Waahab started. Abdul Waahab was such a noob. He went around Arabia destroying historical sites.
In regard to fresh water and salt water not mixing:
The Quran is not saying "in this specific example fresh water and salt water do not mix". The Quran claims fresh and salt water NEVER mix because it says Allah "created a barrier between fresh and salt water" not "in this particular place in the Arctic you will find a place where fresh and salt water do not mix because Allah put a barrier there". Whenever it rains on an ocean fresh and salt water mix.
Quote:Muslim community have a common consensus on the ruling of prayer times pertinent to such situations. In the polar region, a Muslim can synchronize his prayer time with the prayer time in the nearest region where proper sunrise and sunset happens on daily basis or he can synchronize his prayer time with the prayer time in Mecca.
You claim there is consensus, but there is not. According to Abdur Raheem Green, a well known Fascist and Da'i, people who claim that you can use Meccan prayer times (if you do not live in Mecca) "should not be taken seriously" and "there is no basis for this claim":
At 44:40 in the video, during the question and answer portion.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANG6q50OvoA
So, in the words of one of the best known Da'i, Harris talking rubbish... See, nobody can agree on how to interpret the Quran and Hadith, hence we have different Jurisprudence and denominations. Allah did not tell humans whose Quran interpretation is the right one.
In regard to embryology, Keith Moore is a loon. Nothing more to add. He is an opportunist and he has been given lots of fake awards and titles by Dawah sites in order to make him appear like a more important scientist than he actually is.
Anyhow you can find videos in this handy playlist I have linked, where most of the scientists who attended the conference at King Abdulaziz University inform watchers that they were deceived and quote mined. None of the scientists who attended the Shiekh's conference actually believe the Quran is miraculous. Keith Moor is absent because he is a noob.
Top scientists comment on the Quran YouTube Playlist
Featuring:
William Hay
Alfred Kroner
Tom Armstrong
Pete Palmer
Who explain how they were deceived by the Saudis.
Quote:Well, let me add my version to this list by saying:I don't base my world view around these people so doesn't matter to me if I can't prove the existence of the people you listed. However, if we're going to play that game, there is more evidence for them than there is for a Mecca that is several thousand years old, as the Quran claims. We would expect a wealth of evidence supporting the Quran given that it's the truth. Yet Mecca was empty only a couple of hundred years before Muhammad came along.
“THERE IS NO ARCHAEOLOGICAL EVIDENCE FOR THE EXISTENCE OF ARISTOTLE, PLATO, AND SOCRATES THEREFORE, THEY ARE FICTITIOUS CHARACTERS”
Does all that make sense to you? If yes, then go ahead, prove that Aristotle, Plato, and Socrates are not fictitious characters, and bring your ARCHAEOLOGICAL EVIDENCES to support this idea.
The Quran is making a claim that Mecca is really old and we'd expect that if people have been going on pilgrimage there for thousands of years, like the Quran claims, we'd see evidence, such as human belongings or bodies (e.g. a burial site). I'm not asking for evidence for individual people, but of a trend of going for pilgrimage to Mecca between the time of Abraham and the time of Muhammad.
I can go further. The Quran also claims "waves the size of mountains" in relation to Noah's flood, suggesting it was global:
11:42
"So the Ark floated with them on the waves (towering) like mountains, and Noah called out to his son, who had separated himself (from the rest): "O my son! embark with us, and be not with the unbelievers!"
Yet civilizations in Arabia at the time of the supposed flood continue as normal, as if the flood had never happened. Some claim it was a local flood described in the Quran, but just how local is "local"? Local is a purely subjective term which means different things to different people. If it was local then people could simply avoid the flood.
But wasn't the intention of the flood Allah being upset at flawed creation? So Allah took away the free will of the flood victims and then after the flood let the world return to its flawed state. What a waste of human life! Speaking of Allah hating people, Allah must really hate all the starving Africans:
39:52 "Know they not that Allah enlarges the provision or restricts it, for any He pleases? Verily, in this are Signs for those who believe!"
Why doesn't Allah give everyone the food they require instead of hurting them? But of course, it doesn't actually matter if people are starving because we will hopefully seem them in Jannah. Life is just a temporary state before Jannah, so it doesn't matter if there are wars or hunger.
In regard to Spirit of Allah, how did you determine that the translators you listed had a better understanding than that Abdullah Yusuf Ali? We can both play this game. I could list Quran translators that suit my argument at the time, but I chose to remain consistent and always use Abdullah Yusuf Ali.
Regardless, there is no way am I using Sahih International. It's really dishonest translation, as I showed, here, in the topic titled "Newer Quran translations". It's a post science in the Quran narrative translation, hence the Saudis have translated it with certain biases. I'm not going to take a translation that forces the word "sperm" into the text of the Quran seriously.
And the others are just obscure translations. And Muhsin Khan translation was sponsored by the Saudi establishment, who obviously have and agenda and want to continue what Abdul Waahab started. Abdul Waahab was such a noob. He went around Arabia destroying historical sites.
In regard to fresh water and salt water not mixing:
The Quran is not saying "in this specific example fresh water and salt water do not mix". The Quran claims fresh and salt water NEVER mix because it says Allah "created a barrier between fresh and salt water" not "in this particular place in the Arctic you will find a place where fresh and salt water do not mix because Allah put a barrier there". Whenever it rains on an ocean fresh and salt water mix.