If free will was not real

[bennyboy]

Nope, go check a Sam Harris debate. He is one of the biggest free will debaters and he debates the free will I'm talking about, go watch his debate if you're interested.

Your brain is part of the environment. What differs you from a planet? Are you a special little snowflake because you're a human? You're built of the same things, you follow the same laws, you are a part of the universe, you're just particles, nothing more.

You are still strawmanning. Exactly who are you speaking to has contradicted any of this?

Why are you free only if you're not being constricted by a foreign agent? Why a foreign agent, can you adress this? You're constrained by the laws of physics. "Will is the expression of intent, a kind of decision, and free will is the capacity to express intent without compulsion or obstruction." Well then, even by your definition a free will doesn't exist. You're constricted by the laws of physics, by the fact that you're physical. I'm still wondering why in order for your will to not be free you must be constricted by a foreign agent.

. . . because some of the stuff in the universe is me, and other stuff is not-me. When the not-me stuff isn't preventing me from manifesting intent into it, then I have free will.

The way he forms and acts on intent isn't his decision ultimately. Why his intention is to do what he intends to do is not ultimately not his decision either. And it does matter if it traces back to the Big Bang even if it's far fetched, even if you dislike the idea. Even your definition of free will plays by the rules of my definition of free will. Intention, expression everything is ultimately not your decision either. I don't like repeating myself, I've said this several times and you adress it in the exact same way.

I think we are probably done here. One more trip around the merry-go-round and I may lose my philosophical lunch.

Exactly, of course we should hold them responsible but not in same sense we do in the everyday life. It wasn't possible for them to act any other way than they did, we accept that and instead of giving them the electric chair or lifetime prison it would be correct if we instead reconditioned their brains so their intentions become good and make them contribute to society in a positive way. The did form and act on improper intent. But the way they formed, the way the acted, and their intention, none of that was ultimately under their control. It doesn't matter if you think your view is better than my view. Your view is not correct, therefore we don't go by your view.

Except that the law totally DOES go by my view. It does not involve a philosophical outlook about the nature of reality. The buck stops at the human experience, as it should, since we are humans judging humans. And in the law, it's all about intent, and the degree to which intent is freely formed.