(October 16, 2011 at 5:50 pm)ElDinero Wrote: For instance, the possible recent discovery of particles moving faster than the speed of light. Nobody thought this was possible until a few weeks ago. If confirmed, it will force further examination of a theory that has appeared rock solid for a century.
You and IATIA both have good points I will address. First for the cause and effect assumption IATIA brought up. Yes you can lump all instances into one or the other intial starting category I was talking about. The universe was either logical or illogical in it’s creation, they are mutually exclusive, meaning that to be in one they can’t be in the other. Now we now concretely about logic and what entails a logical principle, so ANY logical cosmological model would be grouped into the logical creation model, and by any I mean any, the framework accounts for scientific discoveries not yet made or unknown. Now if by “every instance” can’t be accounted for you mean the certain instances where the universe just tends to form itself first without cause, or changes it’s internal working laws over time without corresponding affects to influence it, then yes your right that is illogical so we group all illogical theories on the other side in the illogical creation model. If you do come up with some highly contorted creation model that incorporates both logical and illogical elements then by reasoning it contains illogical elements and thus satisfies the condition in which a process outside of logic started the universe.
And on to ElDinero’s post. I love when we cut away to the truth and more mysteries appear for us to solve, it’s always exciting. Now while I already went over why my framework catches the known and unknown, it is a 2 state simulator and accounts for unknown science like I said. Since we do not fully know the universe and it is always changing, how can one simply say intelligent design is not one of the possibilities since we don’t have a definitive understanding yet. I have presented a solid enough situation that shows an illogical process at work, can you show me proof that a logically unbound power does not exist. In my model, the ball is in my court, please present me with a situation where one, just one model is presented that lies purely on logic (theoretical, with mathematical, and deduction) that can exist on it’s own without the help of a higher power needing it to come into being. I don’t think anyone can and that’s my point