RE: Quick Poll - Do you believe in God?
June 22, 2015 at 7:22 am
(This post was last modified: June 22, 2015 at 7:30 am by Tonus.)
(June 20, 2015 at 11:31 am)Little Rik Wrote: If we have already discussed this why you keep on saying that the consciousness is a product of the brain?That isn't what I've been saying. I've been pointing out that the mind is a function of the brain, and have explained why, including the evidence for why it is reasonable to believe that. Consciousness is a state, not a product. And we know it's a state of the brain because it's pretty easy to induce by altering brain chemistry.
Little Rik Wrote:We also can induce a feeling as if we are in paradise by taking drugs.You are making my point for me. We know that by altering brain chemistry (ie, physical change) we can cause people to enter a dream-like hallucinatory state. We now know that the same can be achieved when there is temporary loss of oxygen to the brain under certain circumstances. Physical changes to a physical brain produces repeatable results, which implies that the mind is a function of the brain.
That doesn't mean that paradise doesn't exist.
Little Rik Wrote:You see how confused you are?Only by your intransigence in the face of reality. Well, not entirely. I understand why you're reacting this way, but it's still counter-productive for you to do so.
Little Rik Wrote:If you got any evidence that NDEs are bull then show this evidence.Again I have to wonder if you are paying attention. I have not said that "NDEs are bull." I have pointed out that we are learning what causes them, and that it has nothing to do with spirits or souls. It's a logical extension of the understanding that the mind is a function of the brain.
Little Rik Wrote:Oh, please Ton don't talk about ignorant.Then stop saying ignorant things.
Little Rik Wrote:You build up in your mind that physical science got it rightThat's because physical science (which is to say... science) tends to get it right. Our modern world is evidence of that.
Little Rik Wrote:but when i did asked you whether these researchers die and then came back to lifeBecause it's a dumb argument.
so they could tell whether there is God or not you don't reply.
Little Rik Wrote:Ton this is the only evidence, all the rest is just guessing.And you wonder why I call you ignorant?
It seems to me that your arguments regarding the soul come down to your claims, which you admit are just beliefs you seem to have no basis for. Your only arguments in defense of your beliefs are "you can't prove otherwise" and "NDEs." The former is just as easily turned back on you for any counter-claims, and is therefore worthless. The latter is the only thing holding your beliefs together. And if that comes undone, so does your whole belief structure. Maybe that, in and of itself, is reason enough for you to doubt that belief structure.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
-Stephen Jay Gould