Alternatives for people that need something?

[powermanbeard]

I've never been religious, despite having to attend church and Sunday school until I was in my late teens. I am now 36 years old, and find myself more and more troubled by the fact that people I am close to, who are otherwise well-meaning and rational humans, can behave so irrationally when it comes to religion.

I have no interest in forcing/ persuading anybody to believe anything, but I would like them to at least take a second and think about why they believe what they do, and how it effects themselves, the people around them, and the world at large.

Throughout my life, some of my relationships with people I love and care about have been negatively affected by religion, and I can't and don't want to overlook or ignore it anymore.

For example- I find it disturbing that my Grandmother thinks I am going to suffer eternally in hell (for not believing)... but says she loves me. She is, in fact, a wonderful, loving human being, but how can I reconcile that with the fact that she seems to be okay with her knowledge that I will horribly suffer for the rest of eternity? It kind of puts a wedge in our relationship, and leaves me with many questions. Does she realize that is by far the most horrible thing any person has ever said to me? Does she really believe that- literally speaking? If she sincerely believes it and does love me, why would she not spend every second of every day desperately trying to save me by any and all means necessary? I mean, we're talking about eternity here, Grandma. To say those are serious words would be an understatement. Don't tell me I'll probably burn forever and then ask what I want on my turkey sandwich; it confuses me.

It seems like the least common denominator in the case of the people I personally know and care about is that they need some sort of support/ belief system that gives them hope, social structure, and concrete answers that mitigate their fear of the unknown.

For those of you that used to be religious because you needed a support group or some sort of faith-based ideology in order to deal with things in your life, did you find something else that filled that void?


PS I see this coming so, yes, I have communicated to my Grandmother that her belief concerning my fate really bothers and hurts me. The conversation didn't go very far before she shrugged her shoulders in a sort of 'well...that's just the way things work' manner.

I have been open and honest with other religious people as well, and in my opinion, have treated them with respect and kid gloves. It seems that no matter by what manner I try to elaborate on why I don't believe the same things they do (e.g. why I'm not interested in going to church with them or something), they always get angry, defensive, or clam up and say something like "you just don't understand". I think they see it as an attempt to belittle them, or categorically state that everything they believe is not true. This is not my intention. It is such a deeply engrained and emotional subject for them that they seem to forgo any sense of reason that would make for a meaningful conversation; at a certain point, they just get angry or tune out. Sorry, I don't mean to sound so frustrated, but I kind of am.

[Erinome]

Welcome to the forums.

I would suggest getting counseling, or maybe getting involved in some volunteer work. I know volunteer work is what made me feel the best about myself, and I met a lot of awesome people. Also, keeping a journal can be very helpful.

[Minimalist]

but how can I reconcile that with the fact that she seems to be okay with her knowledge that I will horribly suffer for the rest of eternity?

Isn't that more her problem than yours? It is her invisible friend, after all, not yours.

[mediamogul]

I've never been religious, despite having to attend church and Sunday school until I was in my late teens. I am now 36 years old, and find myself more and more troubled by the fact that people I am close to, who are otherwise well-meaning and rational humans, can behave so irrationally when it comes to religion.

I have no interest in forcing/ persuading anybody to believe anything, but I would like them to at least take a second and think about why they believe what they do, and how it effects themselves, the people around them, and the world at large.

Throughout my life, some of my relationships with people I love and care about have been negatively affected by religion, and I can't and don't want to overlook or ignore it anymore.

For example- I find it disturbing that my Grandmother thinks I am going to suffer eternally in hell (for not believing)... but says she loves me. She is, in fact, a wonderful, loving human being, but how can I reconcile that with the fact that she seems to be okay with her knowledge that I will horribly suffer for the rest of eternity? It kind of puts a wedge in our relationship, and leaves me with many questions. Does she realize that is by far the most horrible thing any person has ever said to me? Does she really believe that- literally speaking? If she sincerely believes it and does love me, why would she not spend every second of every day desperately trying to save me by any and all means necessary? I mean, we're talking about eternity here, Grandma. To say those are serious words would be an understatement. Don't tell me I'll probably burn forever and then ask what I want on my turkey sandwich; it confuses me.

It seems like the least common denominator in the case of the people I personally know and care about is that they need some sort of support/ belief system that gives them hope, social structure, and concrete answers that mitigate their fear of the unknown.

For those of you that used to be religious because you needed a support group or some sort of faith-based ideology in order to deal with things in your life, did you find something else that filled that void?


PS I see this coming so, yes, I have communicated to my Grandmother that her belief concerning my fate really bothers and hurts me. The conversation didn't go very far before she shrugged her shoulders in a sort of 'well...that's just the way things work' manner.

I have been open and honest with other religious people as well, and in my opinion, have treated them with respect and kid gloves. It seems that no matter by what manner I try to elaborate on why I don't believe the same things they do (e.g. why I'm not interested in going to church with them or something), they always get angry, defensive, or clam up and say something like "you just don't understand". I think they see it as an attempt to belittle them, or categorically state that everything they believe is not true. This is not my intention. It is such a deeply engrained and emotional subject for them that they seem to forgo any sense of reason that would make for a meaningful conversation; at a certain point, they just get angry or tune out. Sorry, I don't mean to sound so frustrated, but I kind of am.

I can certainly relate to having a family with some...interesting beliefs.

My family has difficulty with me because I do not share their new brand right wing republican tea party values and political philosophy. I'm seen as the "radical leftist" of the family when in reality I am a bit of a centrist when it comes to my politics and moderately progressive in my social philosophy but it's not as though I'm a Marxist revolutionary. Talking to my family you'd think my name was V.I. Lenin! Anyways it is difficult to be at odds with your family's predominant beliefs and I have certainly felt the strain. It has helped finding a group of like minded individuals and having regular contact with them. It helps make me feel less crazy, which is in reality a byproduct of my family making me feel crazy for not believing what they did. Eventually you get to a place where you decide to live how you want to live, believe what you think is right and find a way to interact with your family civilly. It's never going to be perfect and i had to find a way to make peace with that. I stand my ground when I need to but when the elders of the family start in with their beliefs I usually just smile and nod. It's a different generation and they had different values. I feel as though I have felt the effects of in-group type pressure. It is hard to be a minority in a group who thinks in an uniform fashion, they naturally will make one feel like an outsider and that is how folks are often brought back into the fold. Well, that has been my experience.

The thing to watch out for is the philosophies that are like religion for the non-religious. All brands of social and political extremism. Some of the atheists I have know have been swept up into these groups trying to "fill the hole" in their lives. "The hole" is often just a leftover religious impulse that has been engrained into a person psychology by a religious style upbringing.

Hope some of this was helpful.

[KichigaiNeko]