Is absolute 'nothing' really possible and/or coherent?

[BrotherNeto]

Agnosticism is not necessarily the view it is unknowable. It is the view it is unknown and for me according to the evidence we have it is pointless to believe in a God.

[Rhythm]

Well, depending entirely on what it would take for you to be "sure" about something, you may have to wait a hell of long time before you get a definitive answer on that one. Sometimes, we create a long list of excuses for the things we doubt but cherish greatly (for whatever reason). Are you certain that you're trying to investigate this god claiming business, as opposed to simply stalling in the face of your own doubts on the matter (again, for whatever reason)?

[teaearlgreyhot]

(22nd April 2012 00:54)Rhythm Wrote:  Well, depending entirely on what it would take for you to be "sure" about something, you may have to wait a hell of long time before you get a definitive answer on that one. Sometimes, we create a long list of excuses for the things we doubt but cherish greatly (for whatever reason). Are you certain that you're trying to investigate this god claiming business, as opposed to simply stalling in the face of doubt?

I'd like to imagine that I'm trying to investigate it rather than stalling. I've only been a non-Christian for 3 weeks. I'd hardly think that's long enough for somebody to completely come out of a worldview they've been in and defended for their whole life. Could we continue this in my deconversion thread if you like? Half of my threads I've created have gone completely off topic today. Thanks.

[Rhythm]

Heheh, np.

[Norfolk And Chance]

(21st April 2012 07:36)Phil Wrote:  

(21st April 2012 01:17)Norfolk And Chance Wrote:  The Universe = nothing. According to Stephen Hawking anyway - there is the same amount of anti matter in the universe as matter, therefore the mass of the universe is nothing. So actually everything is nothing.

It also gets around the xtian "how can something come from nothing" argument, because everything is nothing anyway!

Quite the brain bender.

You got a citation for this? If there wasn't a small asymmetry between antimatter and matter, there would be no "stuff" and the universe would be empty.

I haven't got a citation, but he said it on TV, and the link for the programme was posted on here, on a thread.

[Phil]

(22nd April 2012 14:52)Norfolk And Chance Wrote:  

(21st April 2012 07:36)Phil Wrote:  

(21st April 2012 01:17)Norfolk And Chance Wrote:  The Universe = nothing. According to Stephen Hawking anyway - there is the same amount of anti matter in the universe as matter, therefore the mass of the universe is nothing. So actually everything is nothing.

It also gets around the xtian "how can something come from nothing" argument, because everything is nothing anyway!

Quite the brain bender.

You got a citation for this? If there wasn't a small asymmetry between antimatter and matter, there would be no "stuff" and the universe would be empty.

I haven't got a citation, but he said it on TV, and the link for the programme was posted on here, on a thread.

Nope. I am aware of Hawking saying there was an excess of 1 out of 1oo million for matter. I would believe you if you said he made that other statement during a stroke. What you might have heard him say is that the big bang should have produced both equally but considering there is obviously matter in the universe, he never said what you claim.

[Norfolk And Chance]

He said there was an equal amount of anti matter to matter. That's what he said. He might have even said an exactly equal amount of anti matter to matter, thus 0.

[Ace Otana]

(22nd April 2012 15:23)Norfolk And Chance Wrote:  He said there was an equal amount of anti matter to matter. That's what he said. He might have even said an exactly equal amount of anti matter to matter, thus 0.

Not just Stephen Hawking either...

[Tobie]

(22nd April 2012 15:23)Norfolk And Chance Wrote:  He said there was an equal amount of anti matter to matter. That's what he said. He might have even said an exactly equal amount of anti matter to matter, thus 0.

If that were true, we wouldn't be here.

[Norfolk And Chance]

My mistake - I've found the clip and he said an equal amount of negative energy to energy, thus the universe adds up to 0.

http://atheistforums.org/thread-11754.html

Click the link and it's explained from 25.20 to 30.00