Hello

[Kane]

I'm not a good dancer

[Brian37]

I should appologise for simply and rudely asking "suni, shia or kurd" without stating a welcome.

Welcome to this forum, I am aware that apostasy is punishable by death in Iraq, I cant imagine what this must mean for you, a life under constant fear I asume.

It's OK Man ... thanks


I am aware that the kurds are a ethnicity, but (at leats what my media tells me) the main factions in struggling for power in Iraq are sunis, shias and kurds - although the kurds are more interested in autonomy.

ah huh

So do you live in the east of Iraq near closer to the Jordan, Saudi Arabian borders?
As far as I know (from the papers I read) the nations bordering your country are currently trying to gain as much influence as possible in Iraq and that Iran, Turkey and Saudi Arabia are the main participants in that game for power.

Jordan is to the west of Iraq ... not East
I live in Baghdad ... It's in the center of Iraq
and the papers you read are right

(In case I`m wrong with my knowlege over the death penalty for apostacy, here`s my source: http://lawarchive.hofstra.edu/pdf/academ...final.pdf)

You're not wrong
Death is the penalty
However ... only my family knows about me
the good we have in Iraq is that
when Azan called for any pray you don't have to do it
plus as long as I keep my mouth shut before strangers .. I'm fine

That sucks that you have to keep your mouth shut. But I reallly get pissed at the right and left who get angrey here in the states when they lose and constanly suffer from short term memory that even with our Consstitution minorities such as women, blacks and gays had to do what you have to do now.

If you were living in the states and someone murderd you for being ANYTHING they would go to jail. Humans hate quick change but hopefully sometime within your generation you wont have to keep your mouth shut.

I still don't get it. They hated the squash of dissent under Sadam but are still willing to do it to others. While that may be a majority, I also get pissed when we find pockets like you and people still insist on lumping the region into one label. I prefure to kill the monster of monopolies from within.

Now while you cant do anything without risk yourself., and none of us have the right to ask you to do that. The fact that word is out all be it anonomous, it says to me that we can communicate with you. And it also says to me that with the age of media, the Arabs and Muslims here, like Senator Keith Elleson(Muslim) and all the Arabs who have western values, can grow the cracks of fascism.

I do not have the right to ask you to take any risk you don't want to take. But I will say any atheist or Muslim or non Muslim Arab who has the same values you do, will ALWAYS have my support. Just know, that even though you are islolated, we can put pressure on your government to eventually get you to the point where you don't have to live in fear.

I cant promise it will happen in your lifetime. But believe me, the west will never stop trying. We don't always need wars to do that, and sometimes we help when we shouldnt and sometimes we don't help when we should.

But, the non politicians and non military, the avarage citizens in the west are thinking of you and are constanly working in both big and small ways to help.

When I read admissions like this I cry. It shows both the worst in humanity that you still cant be yourself and the best in humanity both at the same time in that despite your birthplace reason can and does exist. Even if you cant do anything yourself right now, your presense there is a reminder that humans can and do use reason despite what is arround them.

Those who would murder you for apostacy bitch about being oppressed by the west. Your struggle is not a label struggle, your struggle was the same as Jews in Germany, black slavery in America, womens rights in America, gay rights. It is the struggle human evolution constantly produces and reason has always long term defeated our alpha male mentality.

You give me hope, not givesns for one group or one nation, but you do give me hope for humanity 1,000 years from now, 10,000 years from now in that same Jeffersonian approach to put questioning as the focus and checks on power and monopolies. Once your society understands this, they will understand that if what Sadam did to them was bad, then they should not do that to you either otherwise they are no better than from where they escaped.

Hang tough, but if you ever feel the need to escape we would be damned glad to have you.

[festive1]

Greetings and welcome!

[Darkstar]

Atheists aren't generally like where I'm from, but there is no legal punishment for it. I think I agree with The_Germans_are_coming.

[frankiej]

Howdy.

[Kane]

That sucks that you have to keep your mouth shut. But I reallly get pissed at the right and left who get angrey here in the states when they lose and constanly suffer from short term memory that even with our Consstitution minorities such as women, blacks and gays had to do what you have to do now.

ah huh

If you were living in the states and someone murderd you for being ANYTHING they would go to jail. Humans hate quick change but hopefully sometime within your generation you wont have to keep your mouth shut.

People who do that here go to the green zone and rule Iraq

I still don't get it. They hated the squash of dissent under Sadam but are still willing to do it to others. While that may be a majority, I also get pissed when we find pockets like you and people still insist on lumping the region into one label. I prefure to kill the monster of monopolies from within.

My Death can't help any cause my friend ... afew weeks ago a fellow atheist was killed ... and now he's forgotten

Now while you cant do anything without risk yourself., and none of us have the right to ask you to do that. The fact that word is out all be it anonomous, it says to me that we can communicate with you. And it also says to me that with the age of media, the Arabs and Muslims here, like Senator Keith Elleson(Muslim) and all the Arabs who have western values, can grow the cracks of fascism.

yup ... but not all of them ... you know who I mean don't you ?!

I do not have the right to ask you to take any risk you don't want to take. But I will say any atheist or Muslim or non Muslim Arab who has the same values you do, will ALWAYS have my support. Just know, that even though you are islolated, we can put pressure on your government to eventually get you to the point where you don't have to live in fear.

That means alot to me ... thank you very much

I cant promise it will happen in your lifetime. But believe me, the west will never stop trying. We don't always need wars to do that, and sometimes we help when we shouldnt and sometimes we don't help when we should.

But, the non politicians and non military, the avarage citizens in the west are thinking of you and are constanly working in both big and small ways to help.

We have an old saying here that states :
( Cut the head of the snake ... and you'll kill it )

When I read admissions like this I cry. It shows both the worst in humanity that you still cant be yourself and the best in humanity both at the same time in that despite your birthplace reason can and does exist. Even if you cant do anything yourself right now, your presense there is a reminder that humans can and do use reason despite what is arround them.

That's an Honor to me

Those who would murder you for apostacy bitch about being oppressed by the west. Your struggle is not a label struggle, your struggle was the same as Jews in Germany, black slavery in America, womens rights in America, gay rights. It is the struggle human evolution constantly produces and reason has always long term defeated our alpha male mentality.

for them .. Islam is ALL !
and I curse Democracy sometimes
that you allow them to do whatever they want there
yet you can't do a damn religious thing here !

You give me hope, not givesns for one group or one nation, but you do give me hope for humanity 1,000 years from now, 10,000 years from now in that same Jeffersonian approach to put questioning as the focus and checks on power and monopolies. Once your society understands this, they will understand that if what Sadam did to them was bad, then they should not do that to you either otherwise they are no better than from where they escaped.

Saddam and Ba'th party were secular when they first ruled Iraq
Thanks to the holy wars from Iran First
It's all begun .. and we started to see Mullas on TV
then he wanted to invade Saudi Arabia
He tried to make a Religious War in order to win some Saudians on his side
that's why he wrote with his own hand writing the words الله اكبر
( God is the greatest ) on the Iraqi flag .

Hang tough, but if you ever feel the need to escape we would be damned glad to have you.

I'm really glad to meet a person with your kind of thinking
I'm really honored by that

---

Greetings and welcome!

thank you

---

Atheists aren't generally like where I'm from, but there is no legal punishment for it. I think I agree with The_Germans_are_coming.

He looks like a wise person
thanks for the welcome

---

Howdy.

Hello

[KichigaiNeko]

Stay safe there.

[Minimalist]

By all means, Kane...don't take unnecessary risks.

but all he really had to argue was "Sadam was a dictator".

Er, generally we like dictators. We even liked Saddam when he was attacking Iran.



Bush was very inconsistent about dictators.

[Gilgamesh]

I'm not a good dancer

You're familiar with the Kane-a-roonie, yes? Of course you are; you're Kane!

Don't disappoint me, Kane.

Also, your brother is much cooler.

[Kane]

Stay safe there.

Thanks

I will

---

By all means, Kane...don't take unnecessary risks.

but all he really had to argue was "Sadam was a dictator".

Er, generally we like dictators. We even liked Saddam when he was attacking Iran.



Bush was very inconsistent about dictators.

Yup ... That's the best thing he ever done

---

I'm not a good dancer

You're familiar with the Kane-a-roonie, yes? Of course you are; you're Kane!

Don't disappoint me, Kane.

Also, your brother is much cooler.

Gilgamesh .. cool name
Where's Enkidu ??

Yeah the Undertaker is cooler ... but he's out of the game now