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Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 12:31 pm
I Find 'gods' Acts of punishment and his miracles a bit underwhelming and not proof of his existence. Why? Well likes a looks at his 'punishments' first.
His punishments come in the form of natural disasters, Like hurricanes, tornados, storms etc.. All of which happen naturally, regularly and mostly predictable (I use mostly loosely). Now no matter how bad they are in terms of what you purpose, these are somewhat weak half-arsed attempts to wipe specific people out and ends up cause collateral to the people who he does not want to harm. Nothing divine there.
A if god really wanted to show his power then a lightning strike on the people he wants to kill and its in day time infrount of 1000's of people on a clear day, that's more befitting of a God.
Now his so called miracles are normal statically possible for example the WTC on 9/11. The people who survived that, were statical likely to survive and just happened to be right place at the right time and it was pure chance and could have happened to anybody there, Note: in any disaster there is always 1 survivor and larger the disaster the more people will survive unless its something nobody could survive like a Nuclear explosion (if they have no deep ingrained bunker or some form of protection that was pre planned and tips the odds in your favor).
Now a real miracle befitting of a God would be a Major disaster where everybody survives and is completely unharmed and is against all odds.
For example: A nuclear explosion happens in a major city that is highly and densely populated and it kills nobody, everybody survives against all odds and nobody is harmed. And that's a miracle, if that was to ever happen I would convert there and then that would prove to me there was a god/ess and s/he wanted everybody to survive. But since your god is not like that (or even exists). I highly doubt something like that would ever happen.
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" - Edward Gibbon (Offen misattributed to Lucius Annaeus Seneca or Seneca the Younger) (Thanks to apophenia for the correction)
'I am driven by two main philosophies:
Know more about the world than I knew yesterday and lessen the suffering of others. You'd be surprised how far that gets you' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 12:43 pm
If no harm was done from a nuclear bomb, that could prove that a miracle had happened. (Either that or something like a mass hallucination, which apparently has happened before to thousands of people). But why would that imply a god? And if it implied a god, which god? And why? Why a god? Why not recognize it as some unbelievable miracle that hasn't happened before without the whole "god" part?
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 2:49 pm
Confirmation bias, DvF. They are always looking for signs that their fairy tales are true.
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 3:05 pm
(This post was last modified: November 11, 2012 at 3:07 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Because the credulous mind requires co-conspirators nevertheless. None of us are so gullible that we don't even have an inkling that we may have been taken for a ride.
(no one likes to feel like the only mouth-breather in the crowd...even if they are)
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 4:54 pm
(November 11, 2012 at 2:49 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Confirmation bias, DvF. They are always looking for signs that their fairy tales are true.
Well DvF is right, I would not know which god and I am not talking about mass hallucination, I am talking if it really happened, obusly the god/ess would have to come forward and take responsibility and say why they did it. But since there are no god or goddess I don't think I would ever have to ask those questions. Also I put to see the reaction of the religious and make them use their brain for once, since there bar on miracles is so low. I set mine high, so High only a god could do it.. so far its not been met but anything.
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" - Edward Gibbon (Offen misattributed to Lucius Annaeus Seneca or Seneca the Younger) (Thanks to apophenia for the correction)
'I am driven by two main philosophies:
Know more about the world than I knew yesterday and lessen the suffering of others. You'd be surprised how far that gets you' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 5:13 pm
(November 11, 2012 at 12:31 pm)Gooders1002 Wrote: For example: A nuclear explosion happens in a major city that is highly and densely populated and it kills nobody, everybody survives against all odds and nobody is harmed. And that's a miracle, if that was to ever happen I would convert there and then that would prove to me there was a god/ess and s/he wanted everybody to survive. But since your god is not like that (or even exists). I highly doubt something like that would ever happen.
I find it curious why any atheist/agnostic would say if some absolute proof were given to the existence of a god that would then lead to their worship of said deity. Why? It isn't as if mere existence is enough to be worthy of subjecting yourself to their whims.
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 5:29 pm
(This post was last modified: November 11, 2012 at 5:30 pm by Edwardo Piet.)
(November 11, 2012 at 4:54 pm)Gooders1002 Wrote: [...] obusly the god/ess would have to come forward and take responsibility and say why they did it.
How do you know that it's not an incredibly advanced alien life form?
There's one example of why science can't verify God. In fact Jesus may have really resurrected and the Bible might be completely true, apart from the fact that it was in fact a highly intelligent superpowerful alien lifeform that wrote the book and one of his alien chums that was Jesus.
Gods are usually unfalsifiable: outside the realm(s) of science.
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 11, 2012 at 6:59 pm
Well, Ultra, it wouldn't lead to my worship but I couldn't be an athiest anymore. I'd get to keep my anti-theist badge....and it would mean even more then....but I'd have to retire the atheist chord.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 12, 2012 at 1:10 am
Christopher Hitchens has the right idea to begin with clearly, anti-theist is a much better description for what we should be, even if such a god exists we don't want to listen to it anyway 
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RE: Gods acts of punishment and miracles.
November 12, 2012 at 3:51 am
(This post was last modified: November 12, 2012 at 3:58 am by Godscreated.)
(November 12, 2012 at 1:10 am)Utracia Wrote: Christopher Hitchens has the right idea to begin with clearly, anti-theist is a much better description for what we should be, even if such a god exists we don't want to listen to it anyway
Hitchens plagiarized, it's actually is found in scriptures that are 2000 years old.
(November 11, 2012 at 4:54 pm)Gooders1002 Wrote: (November 11, 2012 at 2:49 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Confirmation bias, DvF. They are always looking for signs that their fairy tales are true.
Well DvF is right, I would not know which god and I am not talking about mass hallucination, I am talking if it really happened, obusly the god/ess would have to come forward and take responsibility and say why they did it. But since there are no god or goddess I don't think I would ever have to ask those questions. Also I put to see the reaction of the religious and make them use their brain for once, since there bar on miracles is so low. I set mine high, so High only a god could do it.. so far its not been met but anything.
Every person saved into eternal life is a miracle beyond all others, don't you think raising people from the dead is a miracle? Of coarse you want understand the miracle of a righteous God forgiving the sinful, but whatever, I do that's why I have eternal life. Yep one day my body will pop out of the ground, and if you happen to see people coming out of the ground it will be to late to try and figure out which God did it, that's if you consider it a miracle.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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