Xenophobia?

[Vera]

They will run out of it, it is something soooo outdated and out of touch with reality that in the end it will disapear.
The role of "the others" will simply change with time and be fixed to someone else.




I am a multicultural kid with a multicultural background, and I live in a world so connected that people from all over the world can expirience the "others" themselves. So I am confident that xenophobia will simply fade away.

Did you know that right wingers in Swizerland campain with slogans warning about:

"Criminal French and German migrant workers"

It is simply the last resort of those who have nothing else left to argue with.

The thing is, we (or a lot of us) seem unwilling to let go of the tribal, us-or-them instinct. I guess it did use to make sense, when you didn't know the neighbouring tribe and hence, had a reason to fear them. But in this century it makes no sense whatsoever. Yet, a lot of people insist on clinging to something whose place is in the distant past.

But look who I'm telling this... of course people insist on clinging to things that belong in the past. Like religion.

The optimist in me kinda hopes that the day will come when the desire to divide ourselves into groups will die its long overdue death, but the cynic in me is saying "Yeah, right."

Am reminded of an old sci-fi series, Space: Above and Beyond, where they had no racism or gender discrimination, but they had "in-vitros", people conceived and born as in-vitros with the sole purpose of serving as expendable soldiers. And while human, those were considered subhuman and inferior to "real" people. So yeah, for the time being the idea of the "other" seems to be an integral part of (some of) [/i]us...

[Something completely different]

I dont think so, I think this "tribal instinct" is fading away.

Look at the people who still insist on something they cant even give a name without looking racist. Most of them are old fools who probably even lived through the times of actual racial segregation.

It is outdated, the main motor behind the dropping of borders is economics and the free exchange of goods, which will in time completly shut them up.

In a world which is so well conected, this "tribal behavior" simply is a thing of the past.

[Vera]

I dont think so, I think this "tribal instinct" is fading away.

Look at the people who still insist on something they cant even give a name without looking racist. Most of them are old fools who probably even lived through the times of actual racial segregation.

It is outdated, the main motor behind the dropping of borders is economics and the free exchange of goods, which will in time completly shut them up.

In a world which is so well conected, this "tribal behavior" simply is a thing of the past.

Well, I sure as hell hope so. And I mostly believe it, too... But then I meet this 20 yo Russian girl, who is afraid of Black people. To the point of crossing the street on seeing one approach her... Ah, did I mention that this happened in Brazil, so she obviously wasn't the brightest bulb in the box... Still, it was rather disheartening to hear someone so young, spout such crap....

[Something completely different]

lol

I am German, I am the last person to be suprised by the existance of racism.

[Tiberius]

Could you specify why you feel that immigrants taking advantage of a welfare system is a justifiable reason to worry about these people?

Certainly.

The welfare system is supposed to be a safety net for people who become unable to support themselves. It is paid into by citizens and tax payers. It should only be available to citizens and tax payers.

Welfare systems only work if they are at least fair. We already have the problem of welfare queens. We do not need people coming to the country and claiming welfare when (1) they have not paid into the system, and (2) there are already not enough jobs for the people already living here (and that includes both foreign and domestic residents).

Edited to add: The welfare system the article mentions is the NHS, which does not require checks like others do.

[The Grand Nudger]

Immigrants cannot become citizens and do not pay taxes?

Jesus christ......you guys don't actually check the people applying? WTF?

(we actually had a problem with "welfare queens" in this country also - the problem being that we couldn't actually find said boogey-women - no matter how much our talking heads railed against them, ah well)

[Tiberius]

Immigrants cannot become citizens and do not pay taxes?

Jesus christ......you guys don't actually check the people applying? WTF?

What are you on about? Of course they can, but that has nothing to do with this issue.

The problem is not with immigrants who decide to work and pay taxes; it is with those who come here and do not work or pay taxes, but still use (free) public services. Should people be able to leave their country of birth and exploit the welfare systems of other countries just because we belong to the EU? I don't think that is very fair.

(we actually had a problem with "welfare queens" in this country also - the problem being that we couldn't actually find said boogey-women - no matter how much our talking heads railed against them, ah well)

In the UK, they actually exist. Some of them are extremely cocky. In the newspapers a few months ago they had an interview with a couple who had a baby and freely admitted that they weren't even looking for work, because their parents had paid taxes all their lives.

[cratehorus]

Immigrants cannot become citizens and do not pay taxes?

Jesus christ......you guys don't actually check the people applying? WTF?

What are you on about? Of course they can, but that has nothing to do with this issue.

The problem is not with immigrants who decide to work and pay taxes; it is with those who come here and do not work or pay taxes, but still use (free) public services. Should people be able to leave their country of birth and exploit the welfare systems of other countries just because we belong to the EU? I don't think that is very fair.

(we actually had a problem with "welfare queens" in this country also - the problem being that we couldn't actually find said boogey-women - no matter how much our talking heads railed against them, ah well)

In the UK, they actually exist. Some of them are extremely cocky. In the newspapers a few months ago they had an interview with a couple who had a baby and freely admitted that they weren't even looking for work, because their parents had paid taxes all their lives.

there is almost no welfare fraud existing in any country anywhere, most immigrants contribute more to a country's economy than it's actual average citizen, the simple fact that your nation chooses to disparage an entirerace of people based on the headline/tabloid story of one vaccous individual just proves how inept and deceptive your government has become, maybe a fresh dip in the gene pool is exactly what you folks need.............

[Vera]

Well, those who have more will always, always be scared of those who have less.

Once you've gotten hold of the bone, there's no way you letting it go just like this. Never mind how exactly your society got to be where it is, forget colonialism, forget exploitation, forget selling a whole bunch of countries to the Soviets, so that you can save your own asses and enjoy your nice, entitled lives.

Just keep your dirty mitts off our grub!

[Angrboda]

Well, those who have more will always, always be scared of those who have less.

Once you've gotten hold of the bone, there's no way you letting it go just like this. Never mind how exactly your society got to be where it is, forget colonialism, forget exploitation, forget selling a whole bunch of countries to the Soviets, so that you can save your own asses and enjoy your nice, entitled lives.

Just keep your dirty mitts off our grub!

In behavioral economics, the endowment effect (also known as divestiture aversion) is the hypothesis that a person's willingness to accept (WTA) compensation for a good is greater than their willingness to pay (WTP) for it once their property right to it has been established. People will pay more to retain something they own than to obtain something owned by someone else — even when there is no cause for attachment, or even if the item was only obtained minutes ago. This is due to the fact that once you own the item, foregoing it feels like a loss, and humans are loss-averse. The endowment effect contradicts the Coase theorem, and was described as inconsistent with standard economic theory which asserts that a person's willingness to pay (WTP) for a good should be equal to their willingness to accept (WTA) compensation to be deprived of the good, a hypothesis which underlies consumer theory and indifference curves.

— Wikipedia:

Ownership endows value by its own virtue, and nature has endowed us to hold dear what is ours. Why? Evolution. The endowment effect begins with the natural propensity for animals to mark their territories and defend them through threat gestures and even physical aggression if necessary, thereby declaring the equivalent of private ownership to what was once a public good. The evolutionary logic runs like this: once a territory is declared taken by one animal, would-be trespassers have to invest considerable energy and risk grave bodily injury in attempts to acquire the property for themselves, so there is an endowment effect. We are more willing to invest in defending what is already ours than we are to take what is someone else's. Dogs, for example, will invest more energy in defending a bone from a challenger than they will in absconding with some other dog's bone. The endowment effect with property ownership has a direct and obvious connection to loss aversion, where we are twice as motivated to avoid the pain of loss as we are to seek the pleasure of gain. Evolution has wired us to care more about what we already have than what we might possess, and here we find the evolved moral emotion that undergirds the concept of private property.

— Michael Shermer, The Believing Brain

(See also Kahneman and Tversky's work on prospect theory.)