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How did you work it out?
#81
RE: How did you work it out?
(March 24, 2013 at 10:06 am)enrico Wrote:
(March 24, 2013 at 9:49 am)Joel Wrote: How do you know that mind does not come from matter?
Everything that has a mind is made up from matter.

As far as we know, minds do not float around unattached to anything. Why? Because they are a product of the brain (Most people's are made up of matter)


After some million of years that humans exist on planet earth none has so far demonstrated that mind come from matter.
Mind can exist without a body (matter) and this has been already been demonstrated by thousand of NDE experiences.

Oh, it's NDEs, then?...
Those are just proof that sometimes the brain goes on working after the body crashed... and when the body is restored to working order, somethings are retained... much like dreams. You know, most people who go through NDEs remember nothing.
Had the brain stopped working, you wouldn't be able to bring the person back to normal operation.
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#82
Re: How did you work it out?
Science solved that one years ago... "NDEs" are completely natural and are caused by the DMT that is dumped into your bloodstream when you are about to die.
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#83
RE: How did you work it out?
(March 24, 2013 at 10:06 am)enrico Wrote: After some million of years that humans exist on planet earth none has so far demonstrated that mind come from matter.
Mind can exist without a body (matter) and this has been already been demonstrated by thousand of NDE experiences.

If you think NDE's are slam dunk proof of disembodied minds you are really a push over. I'll bet you could feel just as certain even without NDE's. Hell I doubt if you really look for anything but confirmation of what you already believe. You don't examine evidence as an aid for deciding what to believe. You use it to bolster up the beliefs you hold unthinkingly regardless. (I don't approve.)
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#84
RE: How did you work it out?
(March 24, 2013 at 10:06 am)enrico Wrote: After some million of years that humans exist on planet earth none has so far demonstrated that mind come from matter.
Mind can exist without a body (matter) and this has been already been demonstrated by thousand of NDE experiences.

.

Really? Not one human has demonstrated that mind come from matter? Not even the humans from millions of years ago that didn't exist?
ronedee Wrote:Science doesn't have a good explaination for water

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#85
RE: How did you work it out?
(March 24, 2013 at 10:30 am)Joel Wrote:
(March 24, 2013 at 10:26 am)enrico Wrote: Opshhh. somebody was telling me that neurosurgeons would not agree with me.
Well, well just look at this neurosurgeon.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/20...rlife.html

http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/this-must-be-heaven

Sorry, sir. I've come across this, before.


I read Samharris article.
I agree that by using drugs or DMT as Sam suggest you could have similar experiences but is really like an ejaculation after a masturbation compared to an ejaculation after you make love in a natural way.
Chemical masturbation with drugs leave a trail of bad feeling and sickness afterwards and Eben Alexander does not really show any traces of mental sickness.
His thoughts are pure unlike those coming from drug users.
The problem with Sam Harris article is that he pretend to study experiences coming from other dimensions using physical science.
This is the usual problem that affect materialistic minds.
Something that i already discussed in this thread.
One desirable day Sam will discover the role of the pineal gland and that day he will understand a lot better how all the system works.Angel


(March 24, 2013 at 8:33 pm)CleanShavenJesus Wrote:
(March 24, 2013 at 10:06 am)enrico Wrote: After some million of years that humans exist on planet earth none has so far demonstrated that mind come from matter.
Mind can exist without a body (matter) and this has been already been demonstrated by thousand of NDE experiences.

.

Really? Not one human has demonstrated that mind come from matter? Not even the humans from millions of years ago that didn't exist?


Ok. let us say maybe one million.
What is your estimate?
Oh, by the way let me know when someone discover that mind come from matter.Cool Shades



(March 24, 2013 at 8:19 pm)whateverist Wrote:
(March 24, 2013 at 10:06 am)enrico Wrote: After some million of years that humans exist on planet earth none has so far demonstrated that mind come from matter.
Mind can exist without a body (matter) and this has been already been demonstrated by thousand of NDE experiences.

If you think NDE's are slam dunk proof of disembodied minds you are really a push over. I'll bet you could feel just as certain even without NDE's. Hell I doubt if you really look for anything but confirmation of what you already believe. You don't examine evidence as an aid for deciding what to believe. You use it to bolster up the beliefs you hold unthinkingly regardless. (I don't approve.)


Your bet won the price.
I feel certain even without NDS's.
By opening the channel that connect the microcosm with the macrocosm the feeling that you exist in a spiritual form pervade your existence.Angel
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#86
RE: How did you work it out?
(March 24, 2013 at 10:45 am)Psykhronic Wrote: I just jumped into this thread after a while of forgetting it exists and somehow maggots have become so fucking special that they are not made of matter. Did I just emerge from a vortex connected to the dumbest realm in existence?


It seems that you are missing some point.
I said that maggots have mind.
This does not mean that they are without a body (matter).


(March 24, 2013 at 6:40 pm)NoraBrimstone Wrote: Science solved that one years ago... "NDEs" are completely natural and are caused by the DMT that is dumped into your bloodstream when you are about to die.


This does not explain why only decent people get these blissful NDE experiences.
If everybody would get these wonderful experiences then even murderers and rapists would get it but by reading the descriptions of hundreds of people who had NDE experiences i never came across of anyone who show bad character.
It seem correct to reward only those who deserve and that is the way it should work.
Now if is true that science say that everybody who die get DMT into bloodstream then it does not really mean that everybody experience the same blissful feeling.
Sometime people who have a bad trip jump down the window.Angel
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#87
RE: How did you work it out?
Quote:The Germans are coming write...........You claimed that maggots dont come from matter, I showed you that the opposite was true and then you disregard it as irrelevant?
I have encountered this narcecist way of answering an argument on various ocasion, a person in love with themselves and his or her worldview, which it consideres to be beautyfull and should therefor not be scratched by anyone, will always simply declare counterarguments as irrelevant due to comfort. So let me ask bluntly: Is it worth debating with you if you dont even accept counter arguments and simply declare them to be irrelvant by the authority your minds disneyworld worldview gave you?


You do the same mistake as Psykhronic that jump to quick conclusions.
When i say that maggots dont come from matter i do not mean that their body is not made of matter and therefore they dont inherit similar body characteristics from their predecessor.
I am rather talking about the mind and furthermore about the essence of the creature (spirit) that is not made of matter.
Without this essence or spirit the maggot would not exist at all.
Without a driver a car can not do anything at all.
It is only when you connect the two that the car or the body start moving and living so is right to say that maggots do not come from matter.
It is only when the spirit can find a suitable vehicle that everything start taking place and life begin.
So let us not mix the two.
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#88
RE: How did you work it out?
(March 27, 2013 at 7:44 am)enrico Wrote:
(March 24, 2013 at 8:33 pm)CleanShavenJesus Wrote: Really? Not one human has demonstrated that mind come from matter? Not even the humans from millions of years ago that didn't exist?


Ok. let us say maybe one million.
What is your estimate?
Oh, by the way let me know when someone discover that mind come from matter.Cool Shades


Try 200,000.
ronedee Wrote:Science doesn't have a good explaination for water

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#89
RE: How did you work it out?
(March 27, 2013 at 1:21 pm)CleanShavenJesus Wrote:
(March 27, 2013 at 7:44 am)enrico Wrote: Ok. let us say maybe one million.
What is your estimate?
Oh, by the way let me know when someone discover that mind come from matter.Cool Shades


Try 200,000.

You probably talk about HOMO SAPIENS while i was talking in general about humans which according to science were present few millions of years ago.
HOMO abilis, HOMO erectus, HOMO ergaster which were using fire and complex tools.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_evolution

The fossil record of human ancestors may go back 6 million years or more, and the genus Homo arose at least 1.8 million years ago when australopithecines evolved into human ancestors known as Homo habilis. Brown says the fossil record of humans is poor from 100,000 to 500,000 years ago, so Omo I is significant because it now is well dated.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/200...122209.htm
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