Rise of "Anti-zionism"

[Minimalist]

Likud does not consider them True Zionists!

[Anomalocaris]

Likud does not consider them True Zionists!

Likud needs to be exiled to the moon of Pluto as soon as Republicans have been dropped from orbit onto Pluto itself.

[GreenAntiTheist]

Anti-zionism has taken many forms over the years but is certainly not exclusively a right-wing ideology. In fact i'd be tempted to say that it's been adopted by anti-racist left wingers (such as myself) in more recent times, more than by anyone else. We mustn't confuse anti-zionism with anti-semitism. Discussing Judaism is slightly different than discussing christianity or islam because Jews consider themselves both a religion AND an ethnic group.

I oppose Zionism (that is, the idea that the jews are entitled exclusively to a certain piece of land because of religious horse shit) because I oppose both racism and religious fascism. I wouldn't expect the UK to be reserved for one racial group only, and neither do I think that its ok for any other country to implement racist policies. Like I say though, there's a delicate interplay between race and religion when it comes to Judaism, so it's always important to emphasise that racism is inherintly wicked but that religion by-and-large remains optional (and all belief systems, whether religious, political or otherwise) must remain open to criticism.

I'm sure in American politics the reasons are very varied for being pro or anti Israel, just as they are in Europe, but we must not mistake opposition to zionism for being some sort of exclusive nazi or fascist ideology.

I completely agree.

[Brian37]

I completely agree. The notion that someone is born superior, and that others can never attain that superiority (Orthodox jews don't even allow conversion, whereas the other two abrahamic religions at least encourage it) is completely vile and we shouldn't take it seriously, for a second. It should be ridiculed for exactly what it is; insanity.

If I built a building dedicated to "The Force" of Star Wars and convinced others that "The Force" was real, people would rightfully call it a cult, but if I got enough members, then they would call it a religion, but the sane call it exactly what it is, INSANITY.

It was more understandable when humans didn't know any better, but when presented with facts and you still ignore them, you are bat shit insane.

[Anomalocaris]

I completely agree. The notion that someone is born superior, and that others can never attain that superiority (Orthodox jews don't even allow conversion, whereas the other two abrahamic religions at least encourage it) is completely vile and we shouldn't take it seriously, for a second. It should be ridiculed for exactly what it is; insanity.

You should observe that some implicit presumption of superiority is integral to most form of ethnic identity and nationalism. Majority of the people on earth pledge allegence to their country not because their country represent a superior construction that is open to all who would contribute to it. Instead they pledge their allegence based on the conviction that the custom, tradition, and blood of their in group is of some ineffable superiority, and the all the out-groups in the could could not provide any adaquate substitutes for.

[Brian37]

Brian more I leave my religious ties the more i realize the bullshit. I agree with you, i am anti-bullshit and anti-ignorance. I honestly do not get how religion as it stand is still around. But hey scientology exists...

It isn't that hard to understand why it still persists. Evolution's only goal is to get to the point of reproduction.

[kılıç_mehmet]

Has anyone else notice the rise of the Zionism conspiracy recently? If I am not mistaken this is a Nazi ideology and I am noticing it a lot more. Is it just the internet or is this ideology starting to pick up steam?

Well, there is one thing in the world the Jews openly propagate. Zionism.
There is no conspiracy, as nationalism must be done out in the open to actually appeal to people, so why go on to form secret organisations or hold meetings in dark, damp corners?

[Brian37]

Has anyone else notice the rise of the Zionism conspiracy recently? If I am not mistaken this is a Nazi ideology and I am noticing it a lot more. Is it just the internet or is this ideology starting to pick up steam?

Well, there is one thing in the world the Jews openly propagate. Zionism.
There is no conspiracy, as nationalism must be done out in the open to actually appeal to people, so why go on to form secret organisations or hold meetings in dark, damp corners?

Well, worship of your own race is stupid even when not attaching it to religion. Trace humans with DNA back far enough and we are all related, and not just to our own species.

[kılıç_mehmet]

Well, there is one thing in the world the Jews openly propagate. Zionism.
There is no conspiracy, as nationalism must be done out in the open to actually appeal to people, so why go on to form secret organisations or hold meetings in dark, damp corners?

Well, worship of your own race is stupid even when not attaching it to religion. Trace humans with DNA back far enough and we are all related, and not just to our own species.

I think we already had this conversation before.
You think its stupid, but look at the Jews. Even after all these years, they somewhat managed to put their shit back together and create a country out of a mandate populated mainly by non-jews.
This is what nationalism is capable of.

[Anomalocaris]

Well, worship of your own race is stupid even when not attaching it to religion. Trace humans with DNA back far enough and we are all related, and not just to our own species.

I think we already had this conversation before.
You think its stupid, but look at the Jews. Even after all these years, they somewhat managed to put their shit back together and create a country out of a mandate populated mainly by non-jews.
This is what nationalism is capable of.

Evolution doesn't care what survivors identify with. It cares only about how many survive.

Based on what happened to the Jews through the centuries, it is almost certain many, many more descendants of those who had been jews 2000 years ago would have been alive today if along the line they had losened their identification with their ethnical heritage.

So as a result of the sort of ancester identification you worship, the ancesters of modern jews had become big time losers in the game that ultimately makes a mockery of human fads and sensibilities - evolutionary survival.