Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: March 29, 2024, 10:27 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
#21
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
(February 14, 2014 at 5:57 pm)Minimalist Wrote: The mythology of the founding of America is almost as piss poor as the mythology behind jesus and mohammed. Reality has become obscure by distance.

I think a healthy view of our founders is that they pointed the way and we have to complete the journey. The American Revolution isn't just a war for independence but an ongoing struggle for a more just and more free society. Abolition, women's suffrage, desegregation, equal-pay, etc. are all individual battles in this war.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
...      -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
...       -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
Reply
#22
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
I don't know..... the constitution was amended once around 1795 to override a court decision and again in 1812 to sort out the election of the VP.

They didn't get around to the 13th amendment (no slavery) until 1864.

It might be my natural cynicism but it doesn't seem as if "change" was high on the agenda.
Reply
#23
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
(February 14, 2014 at 11:19 pm)Minimalist Wrote: It might be my natural cynicism but it doesn't seem as if "change" was high on the agenda.

We're talking about a fledgling nation here, one that had just gotten through the dysfunctional first attempt after gaining independence (The Articles of Confederation). They hit the do-over button in 1787 but just how fragile the new nation was had been underscored by the War of 1812 when the British easily overran our army and burned our capital. Any early attempt to abolish slavery would have triggered secession and the federal government was in no position to fight the Civil War at that point.

Overall, I think they did as good a job as we could reasonably expect of human beings.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
...      -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
...       -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
Reply
#24
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
(February 14, 2014 at 2:14 pm)TaraJo Wrote: And this is really nothing new. It's been happening for as long as I know. Just look at American history; when slavery existed, the slave owners were insisting that regulations (aka freeing the slaves) would put them out of business.

Urhm. Actually they were right on that. About 95% of those who were slave owners when the Civil War started died broke after the war. Much less worrying about a business. They could barely feed themselves.

(February 14, 2014 at 11:19 pm)Minimalist Wrote: They didn't get around to the 13th amendment (no slavery) until 1864.

No. The 13th amendment was added sometime in 1865. Several months after the Civil War was over if I remember correctly.
Everything I needed to know about life I learned on Dagobah.
Reply
#25
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
I didn't look it up.

Actually, the amendment passed the senate in April, 1864, the House passed in it January, 1865 and it was ratified by December 1865. Of course 1864 was an election year and emancipation was not a big crowd favorite in the North, either.

In that sense it reminds me of the old joke about how the Pollocks and Italians are playing football. A gun shot is heard and the Italians think the game is over and leave the field. 15 plays later the Pollocks score.
Reply
#26
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
The originally proposed 13th amendment was passed by Congress in March of 1861 and would have protected slavery in the States for all time.

Corwin Amendment.

Makes you wonder though, if the South was only seceding to protect slavery, yet Congress was falling all over itself to pass the Corwin Amendment and enshrine it as the original 13th amendment, to protect slavery and prevent the Southern states from leaving, then why did the South ignore it and keep seceding?

No one ever seems to ask that.

A truthful Southerner will admit that Slavery had a really large part in the Civil War. An honest one would. But it was by no means the only reason. Not by far.

Shits complicated.
Everything I needed to know about life I learned on Dagobah.
Reply
#27
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
(February 15, 2014 at 2:42 am)Rahul Wrote: A truthful Southerner will admit that Slavery had a really large part in the Civil War. An honest one would. But it was by no means the only reason. Not by far.

Shits complicated.

Uh, no...it's not complicated you ignorant apologetic racist prick.

The U.S. Civil War was about slavery. Which supposed 'state right' do you think the southern states were passionate about? It wasn't for the 19th century version of the Paula Dean cookbook.

Let me guess, you love the rebel flag but regret its association with the KKK. Too fucking bad, symbolism doesn't work according to your soft touch. That's like saying the Swastika is cool except for the Jew thing, or the flag of the Rising Sun is cool except for the Pearl Harbor thing. Or Ukranians didn't die by the millions because of the hammer and cycle thing. What an ignorant ass you are.
Reply
#28
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
My impression was that the issue of state's rights is one that could have been resolved over time via discussion and debate, but the issue of slavery is what made it impossible to have a rational discussion and led to war. The fact that Lincoln did not issue the Emancipation Proclamation until it was absolutely necessary indicates that he knew that it was the one thing that would keep the South fighting until the very last. The South must have known that freeing the slaves (even if the only change was to pay them a subsistence wage and allow them to own property) would have turned them into a powerful economic bloc just through sheer numbers. It's the one issue that I don't think could really have been resolved without a fight.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."

-Stephen Jay Gould
Reply
#29
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
Near as I can tell, Lincoln was a troubled skeptic with a tendency towards deism and a political pragmatist. He can be seen tempering his speech in some of his letters and in his debates with Stephen Douglas. But if you look at what he did, and the majority of his opinions across many other speeches and letter, the man clearly hated slavery; but thought that his chief concern as President clearly was the preservation of the Union first and foremost. That being said, what was the primary reasons for the Confederacy to secede from the Union? There is no debate that it was slavery, everything boils down to it; the entire 'states rights' argument rests it's foundation upon the desire to keep slavery regardless of what legislation the Federal Government passed.

"My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause."
-The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume V, "Letter to Horace Greeley" (August 22, 1862), p. 388.
[Image: E3WvRwZ.gif]
Reply
#30
RE: Billionaire Asshole Shoots Off His Mouth Again
(February 14, 2014 at 11:29 am)Minimalist Wrote: http://money.cnn.com/2014/02/14/investin...?hpt=hp_t2


Quote:Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes

Perkins: $1M in taxes should get 1M votes


Time to roll out the guillotine!

I'd say he's right. He obviously contributes more to the country than a bum on the streets. Voting in and of itself is a stupid concept anyways.
I say abolish voting altogether and install an absolute monarch who will behead him loot his property, and distribute half of it to the masses on a royal parade.
[Image: trkdevletbayraklar.jpg]
Üze Tengri basmasar, asra Yir telinmeser, Türük bodun ilingin törüngin kim artatı udaçı erti?
Reply



Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  What happens if you "tell" a police to f**k off? Freedom of speech? Duty 16 989 April 17, 2022 at 9:35 am
Last Post: Thumpalumpacus
  Asshole conservatives. Jehanne 3 377 July 11, 2021 at 10:15 pm
Last Post: Rev. Rye
  Republican Representative compares his party's fight to Imperial Japanese Soldiers Rev. Rye 2 265 November 24, 2020 at 10:12 pm
Last Post: brewer
  trump the republican asks communist china to investigate his potential election rival Anomalocaris 10 1029 October 4, 2019 at 10:18 am
Last Post: Anomalocaris
  trump announces his bid for reelection! Drich 154 13459 July 18, 2019 at 12:40 pm
Last Post: WinterHold
  Theresa May seen off the coast of Blackpool Cod 0 314 March 11, 2019 at 10:10 am
Last Post: Cod
  Trump has blood on his hands WinterHold 60 4108 December 13, 2018 at 2:59 am
Last Post: Belacqua
  Sh*thole craps on his intel again..... Brian37 2 551 August 3, 2018 at 9:48 am
Last Post: Brian37
  Propheting off dead kids. Gawdzilla Sama 15 1202 May 23, 2018 at 5:45 pm
Last Post: Gawdzilla Sama
  The Banana Republicunt Thinks It Is His Personal Property Minimalist 17 2093 May 20, 2018 at 12:12 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)