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Young Earth creationism
#1
Young Earth creationism
I've meet a young Earth creationist today. He stated the following:
1. The Bible is the Word of God, the ultimate truth. God knows more than humans, since He is omniscient by definition, so anything He says is true. Therefore the Bible is true.
2. Humans, on the other hand, will never know as much as the Creator. Because they have a limited capacity to understand, they will always be below the Creator's knowledge.
3. Scientists are limited to observing and testing the principles of nature only for the present. They will never be able to know what happened in the past.
4. Charles Darwin, the father of evolution, was a racist and believed that there were higher and lower races of people. The whole theory of evolution is based on this racially discriminative principle.
5. Are you really asking me to believe that a star, which came out of nothing, exploded and created the whole Universe?
6. Evolution teaches us that humans evolved from monkeys. How can you explain the existence of monkeys today?
7. The second law of thermodynamics, which is part of science, disproves evolution. A scientific law contradicts a scientific theory, therefore the theory isn't true.
It was very frustrating to argue with a person that refuses to listen to anything you have to say against his beliefs. He eventually gave up, but I doubt he's going to question his own faith anytime soon.
I'm now curious. How would've you responded to his statements?
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#2
RE: Young Earth creationism
All arguments from ignorance and a myriad of other fallacies (evolution has nothing to do with universal origin, for example).

My only advice when dealing with YEC's is to laugh at their beliefs because the are truly comedic. You have to be a special kind of stupid to look at the truly devastating evidence against YEC and still come to the conclusion that the earth, and the universe, is only 6000~ years old.

You can try and highlight the evidence they are ignoring, but then again, you can lead a horse to water.
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#3
RE: Young Earth creationism
And yet another example of YEC ignorance about evolution....it is beyond sad in this day and age where information is available at a push of a few buttons, that there is such ignorance.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain

'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House

“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom

"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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#4
RE: Young Earth creationism
(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: I've meet a young Earth creationist today. He stated the following:
1. The Bible is the Word of God, the ultimate truth. God knows more than humans, since He is omniscient by definition, so anything He says is true. Therefore the Bible is true.
2. Humans, on the other hand, will never know as much as the Creator. Because they have a limited capacity to understand, they will always be below the Creator's knowledge.
3. Scientists are limited to observing and testing the principles of nature only for the present. They will never be able to know what happened in the past.
4. Charles Darwin, the father of evolution, was a racist and believed that there were higher and lower races of people. The whole theory of evolution is based on this racially discriminative principle.
5. Are you really asking me to believe that a star, which came out of nothing, exploded and created the whole Universe?
6. Evolution teaches us that humans evolved from monkeys. How can you explain the existence of monkeys today?
7. The second law of thermodynamics, which is part of science, disproves evolution. A scientific law contradicts a scientific theory, therefore the theory isn't true.
It was very frustrating to argue with a person that refuses to listen to anything you have to say against his beliefs. He eventually gave up, but I doubt he's going to question his own faith anytime soon.
I'm now curious. How would've you responded to his statements?

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In every country and every age, the priest had been hostile to Liberty.
- Thomas Jefferson
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#5
RE: Young Earth creationism
I'm bored so I'll have a go...

(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: I've meet a young Earth creationist today. He stated the following:
1. The Bible is the Word of God, the ultimate truth. God knows more than humans, since He is omniscient by definition, so anything He says is true. Therefore the Bible is true.

Circular reasoning

(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: 2. Humans, on the other hand, will never know as much as the Creator. Because they have a limited capacity to understand, they will always be below the Creator's knowledge.

Presupposision

(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: 3. Scientists are limited to observing and testing the principles of nature only for the present. They will never be able to know what happened in the past.

No those people are called historians

(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: 4. Charles Darwin, the father of evolution, was a racist and believed that there were higher and lower races of people. The whole theory of evolution is based on this racially discriminative principle.

Ad hominem

(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: 5. Are you really asking me to believe that a star, which came out of nothing, exploded and created the whole Universe?

You can believe that if you want, but that's not what the TBBT says.

(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: 6. Evolution teaches us that humans evolved from monkeys. How can you explain the existence of monkeys today?

We didn't evolve from monkeys, we evolved from a common ancestor. To ask a question of the form ‘If Xs evolved from Ys, how come there are still Ys around?’ is to fundamentally misunderstand how evolution works.

(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: 7. The second law of thermodynamics, which is part of science, disproves evolution. A scientific law contradicts a scientific theory, therefore the theory isn't true.

The second law states the entropy of an isolated/closed system never decreases, because isolated/closed systems always evolve toward thermodynamic equilibrium, a state with maximum entropy.
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#6
RE: Young Earth creationism
Point and laugh.

He's so far from being right, he's not even wrong.
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#7
RE: Young Earth creationism
YECs are dumb cunts. There really is no way to be nice about it.
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#8
RE: Young Earth creationism
(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: I've meet a young Earth creationist today. He stated the following:
1. The Bible is the Word of God, the ultimate truth. God knows more than humans, since He is omniscient by definition, so anything He says is true. Therefore the Bible is true.
Ah, right... humans have always defined god in exactly the same and consistent manner.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."

-Stephen Jay Gould
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#9
RE: Young Earth creationism
(July 8, 2014 at 3:49 pm)Baqal Wrote: I've meet a young Earth creationist today. He stated the following:
1. The Bible is the Word of God, the ultimate truth. God knows more than humans, since He is omniscient by definition, so anything He says is true. Therefore the Bible is true.
2. Humans, on the other hand, will never know as much as the Creator. Because they have a limited capacity to understand, they will always be below the Creator's knowledge.
3. Scientists are limited to observing and testing the principles of nature only for the present. They will never be able to know what happened in the past.
4. Charles Darwin, the father of evolution, was a racist and believed that there were higher and lower races of people. The whole theory of evolution is based on this racially discriminative principle.
5. Are you really asking me to believe that a star, which came out of nothing, exploded and created the whole Universe?
6. Evolution teaches us that humans evolved from monkeys. How can you explain the existence of monkeys today?
7. The second law of thermodynamics, which is part of science, disproves evolution. A scientific law contradicts a scientific theory, therefore the theory isn't true.
It was very frustrating to argue with a person that refuses to listen to anything you have to say against his beliefs. He eventually gave up, but I doubt he's going to question his own faith anytime soon.
I'm now curious. How would've you responded to his statements?

1. Unsupported assertions followed by a non sequitur. And why, pray tell, must an omniscient being be limited to saying only what is true? It doesn't follow.
2. More unsupported assertions.
3. A complete misunderstanding of the power and range of the scientific method. Since there can be no such thing as forensic science, according to your friend, tell him you devoutly hope he is on the jury if you are ever on trial for a capital crime and the only evidence they have is forensic evidence -- no eyewitnesses. If he's consistent in his bullshit, you'll be guaranteed a hung jury.
4. First, if Darwin was a racist (and how many 19th Century people can one name who weren't?), so what? It does not bear on the truth of the theory. Second, the claim that Darwin based his theory on this "racially discriminative principle" is simply bullshit -- a cheap smear against Darwin designed to avoid talking about the mountain of fucking evidence from multiple scientific disciplines that confirms the theory.
5. A seriously addled or deeply dishonest distortion of cosmology. Thou shalt not bear false witness.
6. Humans didn't descend from contemporary monkeys. Each share a remote common ancestor. This is so basic it's remedial. Your friend has no clue what he's talking about.
7. Again, your friend does not understand what he's talking about. The 2nd Law applies to isolated systems (e.g., the universe). The Earth is not an isolated system; we are constantly bombarded by energy from the sun. There can be local decreases in entropy in open systems (you and I are evidence of this truth). Evolution in no way violates the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics.
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#10
RE: Young Earth creationism
Unless he is batshit crazy about Literalism, he would be subject to criticism for failing to believe and act upon all Scripture equally.

He may be divorced and remarried, he may fail to go to church on Friday night/Saturday daytime, he may be wearing clothing of diverse fabrics, he may have failed to free his slaves after 50 years of service, he probably hasn't handled a serpent or drank poison recently, he probably does not hate his parents with a Godly heat, he may have to date, failed to father any sons for Christ, he may not have the ability to lay his hands on a child dying of cancer and heal him, he may have eaten shrimp, he may like figs, he may never have offered the Lord the foreskin of an enemy as an offering, etc.

If you play the game by HIS rules, he CANNOT win. And then point out he is more atheistical than he thinks and walk away.
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