How Do You Handle This?

[AFTT47]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/columbi...ar-AAbCNLH

A college woman claims to have been sexually assaulted. She carries a mattress around campus in protest. The man suffers hiring discrimination because of this. Who's right?

How can you tell who is the injured party? The woman is obviously in good physical shape and can handle the burden of carrying the mattress around. Still, it's not a trivial thing. She's not going to do this without reason. Is she a vindictive person, such a bitch she is determined to screw the guy who screwed her despite the burden? Or was she a legitimately wronged party who is willing to shoulder the burden in the name of justice? How is a third party who doesn't know either of them to tell?

Sometimes, there isn't going to be any justice because no impartial person has the power to make a reasonable determination. We usually call a defendant, "not guilty" in that case and it's the best we can do because if we don't know, we should presume innocence. But that system favors the bastards who do bad shit and get away with it because we lack the means to expose what they have done.

I have to reluctantly take the side of the accused because I can't see prosecuting a person for a crime which cannot be proved they did. At the same time, I hate to see someone feel they can act with impunity. I guess the only answer is science, developing better tools to find out who is telling the truth. In the absence of such, what is a juror to do? A woman claiming sexual assault is not going to get any justice. That doesn't only suck for women, it sucks for men who want to get laid legitimately.

Just a rant, I guess. I don't have any real answers.

[Angrboda]

And a rather hasty generalization. Our justice system is designed to place weight on things like doing no irreversible harm and freeing the guilty over convicting the innocent. Sometimes that weight is borne more heavily by certain classes.

[abaris]

[url=http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/columbia-university-sued-by-male-student-in-carry-that-weight-rape-case/ar-AAbCNLH][/url]
A college woman claims to have been sexually assaulted. She carries a mattress around campus in protest. The man suffers hiring discrimination because of this. Who's right?

How would anyone know who's right based on one single msn article on the web?

[AFTT47]

[url=http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/columbia-university-sued-by-male-student-in-carry-that-weight-rape-case/ar-AAbCNLH][/url]
A college woman claims to have been sexually assaulted. She carries a mattress around campus in protest. The man suffers hiring discrimination because of this. Who's right?

How would anyone know who's right based on one single msn article on the web?

Well, I'm assuming they have reported everything of relevance. If not. the jurors would have more and would be better equipped to make an informed decision - which would make this thread obsolete. Let's assume the jurors have what is reported here. It's not an unreasonable expectation.

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And a rather hasty generalization.  Our justice system is designed to place weight on things like doing no irreversible harm and freeing the guilty over convicting the innocent.  Sometimes that weight is borne more heavily by certain classes.

I don't see where I have generalized. I understand that (thank goodness) we would prefer to free the guilty rather than convict the innocent. Indeed, some offenders benefit from that. I hate to see that and wish we could do better.

Like I said. I guess this a rant because I don't see how we can do any better at the present moment.

[Minimalist]

I understand that (thank goodness) we would prefer to free the guilty rather than convict the innocent.

I don't think that's true in the American justice system.  They may pay it lip service but at the end of the day the cops and the DAs will do whatever they have to do to get a conviction.

[bennyboy]

Rape is a deeply serious issue. However, for a woman spited, her spite is also a deeply serious issue. There's really no easy way, without knowing a person well, whether she's a crazy, lying bitch or a brave victim standing up for herself and fighting back. College-aged women have the added feature of being exceptionally crazy bitches and also being very often assaulted.

Legally, though, I think it's pretty simple. If she doesn't have some kind of evidence that the man raped her, she's looking at slander or harrassment.

[Dystopia]

In my country accusing someone of committing a crime in public without pressing charges or proving anything is considered defamation and is prosecutable by law - Your life can be ruined because of it (and the same can be said about spreading false rumours, etc.)

[Pyrrho]

In my country accusing someone of committing a crime in public without pressing charges or proving anything is considered defamation and is prosecutable by law - Your life can be ruined because of it (and the same can be said about spreading false rumours, etc.)

You clearly did not read the article.  According to the article, she did take the matter to the authorities of the school, and she did not name him publicly in the carrying of the mattress.  Here is the first paragraph:

Last fall, Columbia University senior Emma Sulkowicz began carrying a mattress around campus — a protest, she said, of how the school handled her sexual assault complaint against a fellow student. She didn’t name her alleged assailant, but as Sulkowicz’s story and the image of her mattress went viral, his identity soon became obvious. By the end of term, Paul Nungesser denounced on fliers and at rallies and former friends crossed the street to avoid talking to him.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/columbi...ar-AAbCNLH

[Thumpalumpacus]

Charges weren't pressed. She's voicing her opinion of the decision. The public has made his identity known.

There doesn't appear to be an individual to blame.

[Hatshepsut]

Sometimes, there isn't going to be any justice because no impartial person has the power to make a reasonable determination.

Or, there's no such thing as an impartial person to begin with.

And rape is a difficult crime to prove. Since it's a school disciplinary proceeding, the alleged rapist isn't entitled to "proof beyond a reasonable doubt." Title IX reforms now say a school must use a standard of "more likely than not," roughly equivalent to "preponderance of evidence" in civil suits. Except the school's hearing is informal; there are no motions and usually no lawyers either. The maximum penalty is expulsion and denial of degree. Which didn't happen. The article also doesn't say who named Nungesser. Somebody had to, viral or not. I think he'll have a hard time beating Columbia in court. After all, Columbia has a top law school whose faculty will advise, if not represent, the campus.