ObamaCare?

[The Grand Nudger]

We tried that, didn't work.  If it had worked, we wouldn't have needed the compromise of Obamacare and we wouldn't be having this discussion today. The amount of money collected by those taxes was insufficient to meet the demand our society places upon us. It still is.......only ever so slightly (to the tune of some millions of people) less so.

[Ravenshire]

I just got the rate increase from the ins carrier that we selected through the Affordable (joke) Care Act. Currently we're paying $440/month for a $3000 ded and 80/20 copay up to a $3000 limit. Rx copay's vary from $35 to $75 dollars. We have had a relatively quiet year with the major expense being medication for my wife's surgically induced glaucoma and chronic dry eyes. Beginning Jan 2016 the rate will go up to $660/month.

I feel comfortable stating that I hate the Affordable Care Act. We'll have to go online and try to find a different carrier.

It may be less expensive to just pay the IRS fine and pay our medical costs out of pocket in 2016.

Car analogy: I don't mind paying car insurance for car(s) that I am driving. Not sure that I want to pay my neighbors also.

(emphasis is mine)

But, you are. Every time you see a boy racer 18-year old punk fly past you doing 60 in a 35 zone, just remember that he can only afford his insurance because you are being over charged for yours.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

I’m kind of ambivalent about this because I can’t agree squarely with either side. So let’s discuss this.

Pro
How is being forced to pay for health insurance different from being forced to pay for car insurance? When drivers were forced to pay for car insurance, did they make the same objections?

Con
How does being forced to pay for health insurance guarantee affordable health care? When I went to their website to see what they were offering. The premium was low but the deductible was so high you’d have to be half dead before the insurance kicked in.

If the dummies copied the Medicare system of health care plans there would have been a lot less whining.  People can get screwed if they get the wrong Medicare health care plan for their condition as well but they don't whine about it as much.  

If a person is in good health he can take a chance and go with the cheapest plan.  But if something happens and he gets sick he had better have some extra cash on hand to cover the bills.  

If a person has been sickly then he should fork over the cash for the best plan available in order to get the most benefits at the lowest overall cost.  His monthly premiums will be expensive but he will save money when he ends up in the hospital flat on his back with a serious illness.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

Personally, I think it was a shitty compromise, made necessary by the fucking grinches on the right.

The subsidy for low income persons is good, but the deductibles are still liable to bankrupt the poor.

I'd rather see a single-payer system, with copays and other expenses subsidized for the poor.

EHRMAHGEHRD SOSHIULIZM!

You do realize that people on Medicare have to pay deductibles and copays.  So why shouldn't people on the ACA have to do the same?

[Wyrd of Gawd]

I just got the rate increase from the ins carrier that we selected through the Affordable (joke) Care Act. Currently we're paying $440/month for a $3000 ded and 80/20 copay up to a $3000 limit. Rx copay's vary from $35 to $75 dollars. We have had a relatively quiet year with the major expense being medication for my wife's surgically induced glaucoma and chronic dry eyes. Beginning Jan 2016 the rate will go up to $660/month.

I feel comfortable stating that I hate the Affordable Care Act. We'll have to go online and try to find a different carrier.

It may be less expensive to just pay the IRS fine and pay our medical costs out of pocket in 2016.

Car analogy: I don't mind paying car insurance for car(s) that I am driving. Not sure that I want to pay my neighbors also.

It's possible to get some drugs cheaper by paying cash than it is by going through your insurance plan.  Google "cheap drugs" or Google the specific drugs.  Some big box chains offer some generics for $4 for a 30 day supply.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

For starters, you'd be forcing other people to comply with the death sentence you've given yourself for the crime of poverty.  

DNR's already do that. Patients can also refuse medication and medical procedures that would be 'lifesaving'. So in your ideal world, I would be forced to receive medical care I do not want just to make the doctor rest easier? 

I would imagine many poor people who WANTED health insurance will or have already signed up for obamacare and are receiving the medical care they CHOOSE to have. I am not poor by circumstance though, I am low income by choice. I come from an affluent family, I could suck up to them and leech like my cousins do, but I don't. My husband and I just choose not to lead a materialistic lifestyle, and thus, do not need or want excess amounts of money nor all the bullshit that comes with earning it. My issue is mostly about not wanting to be forced to undergo procedures/treatments/exams I DON'T WANT whilst still having to pay for those I DO WANT.  It's like being told "the government is forcing you to buy the red SUV when you want the blue car. You can still buy the blue car too but you still have to pay for the red SUV AND your neighbor with 57 accidents and 21 DUI's red SUV too since they keep crashing theirs.". It's a matter of principle.

I also do not trust the government one iota not to (at some point) begin requiring certain things (like gynecological exams, mammograms, colonoscopies ect...) to remain insured yet penalize/arrest you for not being insured, therefore forcing you into having these exams and procedures done like it or not. That also opens the door to then require treatment be administered, like it or not, if a problem is uncovered. That removes individual choice over their own body. I don't like the government meddling in this stuff and just want no part. Come up with a better system with less government involvement, and maybe I'll nibble and entertain the notion of becoming insured again. I did have health insurance before it became a governmental mandate to have it and to pay for other people who take shit care of themselves to have it too. Dropped it as soon as uncle Sam stuck his grubby little fingers in the pot.

You are a member of the American herd.  Your health condition is a matter of national security.  The reason why we have Medicare and the ACA  is because we had a manpower shortage during WWII because so many people failed their military physicals.  So almost every President since Truman tried to get a national health care plan to improve the health of Americans.

Johnson got Medicare.  Nixon might have been able to get a national plan for everyone but he had political problems.  Bush got the prescription plan.  Obama got the ACA.  It's up to someone else to improve those plans.  And if you want to die some States now offer doctor assisted suicide.

[Jackalope]

Personally, I think it was a shitty compromise, made necessary by the fucking grinches on the right.

The subsidy for low income persons is good, but the deductibles are still liable to bankrupt the poor.

I'd rather see a single-payer system, with copays and other expenses subsidized for the poor.

EHRMAHGEHRD SOSHIULIZM!

You do realize that people on Medicare have to pay deductibles and copays.  So why shouldn't people on the ACA have to do the same?

Of course they do, and I'm not suggesting otherwise. What I am suggesting is that there should be subsidies for those expenses for those who cannot afford them.

I'm interested in satisfying the goal of ensuring that every person in the USA has access to health care. Our neighbor to the south has managed to do so despite having a per-capita GDP that is a fraction of ours. I can understand that there may be ideological objections to doing so, but there is no economic reason we cannot.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

The tax system is confusing enough without having everybody pick and choose what their individual tax dollars can and cannot pay for.

Then make it a general tax across the board. Not a specific tax and penalty directly related to healthcare.

You pay a specific tax to mail a letter.  Why shouldn't you pay a specific tax to support the healthcare system?  Besides, you pay a specific tax to support the school system even if you don't use it.

[brewer]

This article came out yesterday.

http://news.yahoo.com/prices-politics-ch...nance.html#

[brewer]

New article.

http://news.yahoo.com/obama-administrati...nance.html