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Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities
#1
Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities
Typically, monotheists like to claim that 1) God is infinite and perfect both ontologically and morally, and 2) God created matter ex nihilo. But I see a logical contradiction in each claim. Aside from the problems that seem to arise in suggesting that a perfect being acted imperfectly in creating a world which was necessarily evil, albeit relatively, how could an infinite being coexist with the "nothingness" from which he supposedly willed matter into existence?

With regards to the first claim, if God was the utmost of perfection, then it would not be consistent with his nature to create anything less than a perfect world. Any such act would be a degradation from the ontological and moral perfection that existed to an infinite degree prior to his diluting this state of existence with objects that were in any way less than his own perfection. And only an imperfect being could or would bring about a degradation from that which existed prior. As the universe we live in is not a perfect world (and no world that lacked those properties such as the one comprised exclusively of the infinitely perfect being could be a perfect world--in other words, a clone of God Himself and an existence which comprised only his own perfect essence), it could not have been brought about by an infinitely perfect being.

To the second point, theists commonly claim that God made matter from "nothing." But if God is an infinite being, then nothingness could not signify anything but God Himself. "Nothingness" implies negation of being, which could apply to nothing insofar as being is limitless or unbounded, as infinite being implies. God could have only created matter from being, namely His own being. Thus, creation ex nihilo and God as infinite being are logically contradictory premises.
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
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#2
RE: Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities
I agree. In their attempts to power up their god to the max, so no one can jump in with a bigger one, they tie him up in knots. He often ends up not even able to do anything by being "timeless". The result is the least powerful entity possible.

It's all such a stupid idea, and the lack of explanatory power is exposed very well by your post.

"If I use enough impressive sounding words, and insist it is necessary, then it's real."
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#3
RE: Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities
Another problem I see here is how theists attribute "perfection" to their God with such pompous confidence despite the fact that they have no real way of defining or explaining the meaning of the word "perfect" as it relates to a God. Perfect compared to what? Has he set his own standards for himself? What objectives are his performance being measured against, and who is doing the grading?

The most specific explanation I've ever heard from the theist camp is along the lines of: "well, God is just ya know...the Bestest."

Theists, what does it mean for God to be perfect? How do you define divine perfection?
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
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#4
RE: Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities
Me, me! I'll answer! 

God has met and surpassed all his KPI's
God has reached all his goals and objectives set out to him (by him)
God employs  the "lean manufacturing system" for greatest efficiency
God also subscribes to the "Just In Time" manufacturing principles to keep his capital costs down to a minimum
God is a founding member of many charitable organisations (including but not limited to "the Calabria Club")

Lies
No God, No fear.
Know God, Know fear.
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#5
RE: Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities
(May 7, 2016 at 8:52 am)LadyForCamus Wrote: Another problem I see here is how theists attribute "perfection" to their God with such pompous confidence despite the fact that they have no real way of defining or explaining the meaning of the word "perfect" as it relates to a God.  Perfect compared to what?  Has he set his own standards for himself?  What objectives are his performance being measured against, and who is doing the grading?  

The most specific explanation I've ever heard from the theist camp is along the lines of: "well, God is just ya know...the Bestest."

Theists, what does it mean for God to be perfect?  How do you define divine perfection?

Or conversely, what it would it mean for a god to not be perfect?

If the only standard is himself, how can he fail?
Feel free to send me a private message.
Please visit my website here! It's got lots of information about atheism/theism and support for new atheists.

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Quickstart guide to the forum
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#6
Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities
(May 7, 2016 at 9:05 am)ignoramus Wrote: Me, me! I'll answer! 

God has met and surpassed all his KPI's
God has reached all his goals and objectives set out to him (by him)
God employs  the "lean manufacturing system" for greatest efficiency
God also subscribes to the "Just In Time" manufacturing principles to keep his capital costs down to a minimum
God is a founding member of many charitable organisations (including but not limited to "the Calabria Club")

Lies


He also follows FIFO (first in, first out) protocol for dry food storage according the standards put forth by the Department of Health. This guy is on top of his SHIT!
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
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