Thinking about converting, but what if I do go to Hell??...

[yuriythebest]

(11th September 2010 01:45)Rev. Rye Wrote:  

(31st August 2010 02:09)dave4shmups Wrote:  Alright, don't laugh now! I've been a Christian for over 10 years, but want to become an atheist. But how do I know that there is no Hell, that God has never spoken to me (I've had thoughts come into my mind that I don't think are my own), etc? Also, I've read a lot of books by people like Lee Strobel, and they seem pretty convincing evidence for the Bible and for the resurrection.

But I have read Dawkins book "The God Delusion", and loved Sam Harris book "Letter to a Christian nation" and loved the latter!!

All I know is that the idea of a God and Hell and demons influencing people seems like nonsense to me now. So please help me out here with my doubts!

Well, if this question bothers you, here's another thing to think about: What if Baal turned out to be real, and during the competition in 1 Kings 18, he really was on the john the whole time? (fun fact: apparently "travelling" was a popular euphemism for being on the crapper at the time) What if he was just as petty as Jehovah makes himself out to be in the Bible? The point is that you shouldn't let fear of possible punishments keep you from figuring out your beliefs for yourself.

to expand on that, the world has thousands of religions, from christianity to islam to budhism to the ancient greek/roman gods to all the smaller village religions/ancestor worship/etc - What if, say, islam or Zeus turns out to be real? you'll be just as screwed

[HeyItsZeus]

(10th September 2010 03:36)solja247 Wrote:  

Quote:Yes I can.... get ready for this one...it's a shocker
If I have 2 apples and you give me 2 apples.......I have 4 apples.

Will it always equal 4? perhaps it will equal 5? There is still a possibility...

So one apple appears from thin air then?

[ABierman1986]

(10th September 2010 03:36)solja247 Wrote:  

Quote:Yes I can.... get ready for this one...it's a shocker
If I have 2 apples and you give me 2 apples.......I have 4 apples.

Will it always equal 4? perhaps it will equal 5? There is still a possibility...

It can equal 5 tomorrow if you want to define it that way. Math is axiomatic, it relies on certain foundational assumptions that can't be empirically proven, and the framework is derived from that. You want to define 2+2=5, go ahead, but you are going to have a hell of a lot tougher time making any complex calculations from that, unless you decide to just exempt that equation, then its arbitrary, so which is it? If you want to make a strong case ask why G is what it is, or what would happen if the fibbonacci sequence were in a different form in nature, if those things change then there would be substantial evidence for some higher power at work.

Math is like God, made and defined by man, how we want, when we want, for the purpose we want.

[solja247]

Quote:Math is like God, made and defined by man, how we want, when we want, for the purpose we want.

According to you...

[ABierman1986]

Well, and you depending on what you consider previous iterations of dead religions, a misunderstanding used by people as they saw things, when they saw them, in a way that suited them. What were those previous iterations if not that?

[yuriythebest]

(12th September 2010 01:54)ABierman1986 Wrote:  Math is like God, made and defined by man, how we want, when we want, for the purpose we want.

not quite - just like with science, while our knowledge of different complex maths problems/theories/etc continues to increase there are no splits (unless it's something new/controversial I'd assume) and maths in pakistan is the same as in the US or Ukraine. On the other hand, since different religions do not have that firm foundation and are based on subjective opinions/experiences/stories/etc we see all sorts of different religious dogmas - indeed there are too many to count.

[lrh9]

I'd really like to hear from dave4shmups again. Been 6 days since his last reply in this thread.

[dave4shmups]

(12th September 2010 14:35)lrh9 Wrote:  I'd really like to hear from dave4shmups again. Been 6 days since his last reply in this thread.

Well, I'm no longer worried about a hell anymore. Religion is pure mind control; at the last church that I went to, we were told that we were under a curse if we didn't tithe-a curse?! Is this not the 21st century?! No, I don't think there's any proof, much less room for, a belief in heaven, hell, gods or goddesses, angels or demons.

Consider that this same former pastor attributes so much bad in this world to sin-it's "evil" that his toddler son is having nightmares, despite the fact that those can be probably be explained psychologically. In any event, if Jesus was real and loved children as much as the Bible indicates that he did, couldn't he prevent such events??

I could go on and on, but I will never set foot in a church again. My Atheism has been solidified, to that extent.