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nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
#1
nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
Hey guys, this is my first post...and I'm a Christian, so I'm off to a bad start, but please go easy on me. Just thought I'd give you's a few things to chew on.
First of all, I do believe there was a big bang that created the universe, the thing that gets me though is where the fudge everything came from, like whatever went bang...it has to come from somewhere. So, i was reading about hawkings saying that there doesnt need to be a God to create the universe, but think about it logically, nothing -> universe. No matter what way he phrases it, it just doesnt add up. I currently have nothing in my hand, and I will continue to have nothing in my hand until I pick up something, basic science.
Another thing that gets me, and i hope someone can explain this but i doubt it, once the world was created...where did life come from? Where did that first cell with basic dna come from? Granted I only studied science in school, but even the most basic bacteria have quite complex dna. So, for those who dont believe in creation...where did life come from? if indeed every living thing evolved from 1 cell to begin with, where did that first cell come from? i do believe in evolution by the way...to an extent lol.
Heres another 1, atheists say that there is no God, fair enough, but can anyone actually prove, with evidence, that there is no God?
So, theres a lot of stuff there, and no doubt ill just be mocked but id appreciate if people could give me actual answers and evidence to back up what they are saying.
Thanks
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#2
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
You believe in evolution....to an extent?

Anyway, using your own logic of something coming from nothing, how logically do you come to the conclusion that an even more complex being than the universe i.e. God came out of nothing? And just saying "because god always existed" dosen't count, if your asking for a scientific response for your question, I'd expect the same rules to apply to your answer to my question.

Just because nobody can prove if a god does or does not exist, that dosen't mean its 50/50 or that he does exist. And it certainly dosen't give your religion the right to claim you know he exists and you know how he wants us to live our lives.

Science dosen't claim to have all the answers, you and the followers of your religion do, so I'd suggest the burden of providing any sort of proof of anything in relation to the beginning of the universe lays with you.
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#3
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
1) The Big Bang was the expansion of space-time. Nothing went "bang". The universe already existed in a singularity, without time (so there was no "before") and at the moment of the Big Bang, space and time started expanding, and the universe with it. So there was never "nothing", there was always "something".

2) Basic bacteria *today* have complex DNA. This is not true of the bacteria in the past. Complexity increases the more organisms evolve. The first living organisms were self-replicating cells that were most likely composed of RNA (the precursor to DNA). As for how they got there, you'd have to read up on abiogenesis, but it involves the early Earth environment being in the right state for life, and a spark of energy (possibly lightning) that formed the first chemical reactions that led to self-replicating organic material.

3) *Some* atheists say there is no God. *Most* atheists say they don't believe there is a God. There is a big difference in denying outright the existence of something, and simply not having a belief in it. I am the latter; I describe myself as an agnostic atheist. Agnostic in that I make no claims to "know" God doesn't exist, or that I can prove it doesn't. Atheist in that I do not believe that God exists.
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#4
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
(September 10, 2010 at 4:47 pm)norbrook Wrote: Hey guys, this is my first post...and I'm a Christian, so I'm off to a bad start,
Yeah. XD

norbrook Wrote:First of all, I do believe there was a big bang that created the universe, the thing that gets me though is where the fudge everything came from, like whatever went bang...it has to come from somewhere. So, i was reading about hawkings saying that there doesnt need to be a God to create the universe, but think about it logically, nothing -> universe. No matter what way he phrases it, it just doesnt add up. I currently have nothing in my hand, and I will continue to have nothing in my hand until I pick up something, basic science.
God gets a wild hair up his ass -> universe makes about just as much sense.

norbrook Wrote:So, for those who dont believe in creation...where did life come from? if indeed every living thing evolved from 1 cell to begin with, where did that first cell come from? i do believe in evolution by the way...to an extent lol.
I don't know, to be honest. I'm not an all-knowing being. But I can tell you that something that cannot be explained is not proof of God.

norbrook Wrote:Heres another 1, atheists say that there is no God, fair enough, but can anyone actually prove, with evidence, that there is no God?
My friend, the burden of proof is on you. Can YOU prove what we don't believe in? We aren't the ones who believe. We don't have to prove it's real. You do.

norbrook Wrote:So, theres a lot of stuff there, and no doubt ill just be mocked but id appreciate if people could give me actual answers and evidence to back up what they are saying.
For your sake, I'll try, but it's hard to be diplomatic with a person who believes in something that I think it pretty fucking stupid.

Question: are you one of those "light" Christians that think the Bible is untrue?
Eeyore Wrote:Thanks for noticing.
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#5
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
I thought this was an atheist website? I just want to get YOU guys thinking...I'm not saying what I believe in is correct, or indeed any other religion. Listen, you believe there is no God...why? Thats what im basically saying here...as you say, nobody can prove if a God does or does not exist, so i cant actually explain to you through science how God has always existed, but then again you cant prove he has never existed.

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#6
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
norbrook Wrote:I'm not saying what I believe in is correct, or indeed any other religion.
Then why do you believe it? Why believe something if you don't know it's real?

(September 10, 2010 at 5:05 pm)norbrook Wrote: Listen, you believe there is no God...why?
No evidence.

norbrook Wrote:nobody can prove if a God does or does not exist, so i cant actually explain to you through science how God has always existed, but then again you cant prove he has never existed.
Good, we can agree on that.

Eeyore Wrote:Thanks for noticing.
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#7
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
(September 10, 2010 at 5:05 pm)norbrook Wrote: I thought this was an atheist website? I just want to get YOU guys thinking...I'm not saying what I believe in is correct, or indeed any other religion. Listen, you believe there is no God...why? Thats what im basically saying here...as you say, nobody can prove if a God does or does not exist, so i cant actually explain to you through science how God has always existed, but then again you cant prove he has never existed.

This is a basic misunderstanding of atheists that virtually every theist seems to have. We can't disprove all gods. Many atheists merely lack belief in God. We might believe that the existence of any god is unlikely, because the notion of a disembodied mind outside time is so far from our experience, just as you probably believe that the existence of fairies is unlikely. Also, certain definitions of God, like God as an all-loving being, are less likely given the existence of, say, immense suffering. Nonetheless, few of us are certain of God's non-existence, so hold no burden of proof.
'We must respect the other fellow's religion, but only in the sense and to the extent that we respect his theory that his wife is beautiful and his children smart.' H.L. Mencken

'False religion' is the ultimate tautology.

'It is just like man's vanity and impertinence to call an animal dumb because it is dumb to his dull perceptions.' Mark Twain

'I care not much for a man's religion whose dog and cat are not the better for it.' Abraham Lincoln
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#8
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
(September 10, 2010 at 5:10 pm)chasm Wrote:
norbrook Wrote:I'm not saying what I believe in is correct, or indeed any other religion.
Then why do you believe it? Why believe something if you don't know it's real?

(September 10, 2010 at 5:05 pm)norbrook Wrote: Listen, you believe there is no God...why?
No evidence.

norbrook Wrote:nobody can prove if a God does or does not exist, so i cant actually explain to you through science how God has always existed, but then again you cant prove he has never existed.
Good, we can agree on that.
i know its real, but at the same time, i dont want to ram what i believe in down your throats. just want to get yous thinking. but you clearly arent if you just throw back at me "no evidence"
adrian...read what you said...so you believe that there was always something...we are on the same wavelength lol. also...what you said about creation of life, ok...did you get all that from wiki? lol, its not far away from spontaneous generation, and that was disproved a long time ago.

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#9
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
(September 10, 2010 at 5:20 pm)norbrook Wrote: i know its real,
How?

Eeyore Wrote:Thanks for noticing.
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#10
RE: nothing, nothing, nothing...big bang?
The Omnissiunt One Wrote:This is a basic misunderstanding of atheists that virtually every theist seems to have. We can't disprove all gods. Many atheists merely lack belief in God. We might believe that the existence of any god is unlikely, because the notion of a disembodied mind outside time is so far from our experience, just as you probably believe that the existence of fairies is unlikely. Also, certain definitions of God, like God as an all-loving being, are less likely given the existence of, say, immense suffering. Nonetheless, few of us are certain of God's non-existence, so hold no burden of proof.

Sorry, my bad, i get what you are saying. although, just a question, dont bite my head off lol, have you actually ever read a bible? like theres a lot of good stuff in there...give it a read, go on...whats the harm?...it has a lot of good lessons for life in general, even if you dont believe there is a God.
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