Current time: 26th May 2013, 10:28
Our server costs $125 a month to run. Since January 2013 we have raised $263.37.
Please help keep our community online by donating what you can. Also visit our sister site: Freethought Forums!
Please help keep our community online by donating what you can. Also visit our sister site: Freethought Forums!
|
Can a xtian god be free?
|
|
15th March 2011, 06:57
 Post: #1 |
||||||
|
||||||
|
Can a xtian god be free?
Assigning a god the supposed attributes of being the locus of morality, omnibenevolent and freedom to act. Ignoring issues with reality are these attributes contradictory?:
0. If a god exists he is the locus of morality, omnibenevolent and totally free to act. 1. As the locus of morality a god could only ever choose to do good things (such that it is necessarily true that, this god cannot do evil things) as determined by their nature. 2. An ominbenevolent god would only ever choose to do good things (or at lest the maximum amount of good things) 3. A god who is totally free to act must be able to choose to do evil things or not maximise the amount of good things that happen 4. A god does not exist |
||||||
|
"I still say a church steeple with a lightning rod on top shows a lack of confidence"...Doug McLeod.
|
||||||
|
||||||
Kudos given by (1): The Omnissiunt One |
|
15th March 2011, 19:05
Post: #2 |
||||||
|
||||||
|
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
Shouldn't this be in Christianity?
Logical flaw on par with making a circle square. God, being the source of all things can only do good. That's how the Xtian God is formulated. therefore God cannot do evil... it's a logical impossibility. Simple fail. |
||||||
|
"I don't judge Homer & Marge - we leave that to a vengeful God to do" - Bart & Lisa's foster parent, Edna Flanders in "Home Sweet Home"
"Everyone has claims, even me." - Brian37 |
||||||
|
|
|
15th March 2011, 20:02
Post: #3 |
||||||
|
||||||
|
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
So your god isn't entirely free to act, he cannot perform all logically possible actions because he is limited to doing morally good things (like drowning Japanese people...)
He can't have unlimited power if he lacks the power to do evil, so his omnipotence and omnibenevolence are incompatible. |
||||||
|
.
|
||||||
|
|
|
15th March 2011, 20:28
Post: #4 |
||||||
|
||||||
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
Quote:God, being the source of all things can only do good. When you spout utter bullshit like that, Frods, you can't accuse others of logical 'flaws.' |
||||||
![[Image: Atheismreality_zps62a2c96a.jpg]](http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k619/jcincain/Public/Atheismreality_zps62a2c96a.jpg) |
||||||
|
||||||
Kudos given by (3): Napoléon, downbeatplumb, theVOID |
|
15th March 2011, 20:47
Post: #5 |
||||||
|
||||||
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
(15th March 2011 19:05)fr0d0 Wrote: Shouldn't this be in Christianity? Well, when you define "good" as "anything God does", then I suppose your deity can get away with all manner of depravity. Why you would want to worship a being that drowns toddlers is beyond me. |
||||||
|
Science flies us to the moon and stars. Religion flies us into buildings.
God allowed 200,000 people to die in an earthquake. So what makes you think he cares about YOUR problems? |
||||||
|
|
||||||
Kudos given by (3): downbeatplumb, The Omnissiunt One, theVOID |
|
15th March 2011, 21:14
Post: #6 |
||||||
|
||||||
|
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
Total freedom isn't even a coherent concept in my view. Philosopher of religion Richard Swinburne defines it as God's acting without his desires exerting any causal influence, but surely the whole point of desires is that they exert a causal influence.
|
||||||
|
'We must respect the other fellow's religion, but only in the sense and to the extent that we respect his theory that his wife is beautiful and his children smart.' H.L. Mencken
'False religion' is the ultimate tautology. 'It is just like man's vanity and impertinence to call an animal dumb because it is dumb to his dull perceptions.' Mark Twain 'I care not much for a man's religion whose dog and cat are not the better for it.' Abraham Lincoln |
||||||
|
|
|
15th March 2011, 21:16
Post: #7 |
||||||
|
||||||
|
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
You cannot intentionally act without desires, period.
|
||||||
|
.
|
||||||
|
|
||||||
Kudos given by (1): The Omnissiunt One |
|
15th March 2011, 21:32
Post: #8 |
||||||
|
||||||
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
(15th March 2011 20:28)Minimalist Wrote:Quote:God, being the source of all things can only do good. He is a Xtian. A Xtian can't but sprout bullshit like that where Xtianity is concerned, otherwise he wouldn't be a Xtian any more. However Xtains may misapply the term free, they are not free to give up the bullshit without also giving up Xtainity. |
||||||
|
|
||||||
Kudos given by (1): ozgoat |
|
16th March 2011, 00:14
Post: #9 |
||||||
|
||||||
|
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
My understanding is that the Abrahamic God is logically impossible IN THAT: People have ascribed mutually exclusive characteristics to him. Viz; omnipotence, omniscience and omniprescence.
However, Abrahamic mystics through centuries have insisted that being infinite,God may not even be discussed in any meaningful way,he just IS. Coincidentally the meaning of his name YHWH ;" I am who am." He either exists or he does not. I don't believe due to lack of evidence. I reject the notion of an absolute logical inference in the theoretical. In the practical, logic is usually close enough to inform daily behaviour. Sadly, few human beings are capable of consistent logical thought or behaviour. |
||||||
|
Man is not so much a rational animal as a rationalising one.
|
||||||
|
|
|
16th March 2011, 00:19
Post: #10 |
||||||
|
||||||
|
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
I'm a complete non-cognitivist towards that kind of "I am that I am" God, the whole concept is nonsensical so believing in it makes you an idiot.
|
||||||
|
.
|
||||||
|
|
||||||
Kudos given by (1): lilphil1989 |
|
« Next Oldest | Next Newest »
|
User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)