Maureen Dowd Gets to the heart of the Pervert Priest Scandal

[Minimalist]

Quote:because they sympathise with the perpertrators.

And because they need to protect the church's money from the victims.

[Violet Lilly Blossom]

(17th March 2011 17:09)OnlyNatural Wrote:  

Quote:Mark fell apart and attempted suicide.

There are just no words to describe my utter disgust... I grieve for the young lives destroyed by these monsters.

How do you manage to fail suicide? It's easy enough to kill someone else... how can you possibly fail to commit suicide when you *try* to do it? 0.o

I can understand feeling suicidal and wanting to kill oneself and choosing not to for any number of reasons... but actually failing when one is attempting suicide? Were they physically incapable of killing themself? I just can't take that seriously otherwise.

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(17th March 2011 18:49)downbeatplumb Wrote:  Do they do charity drives to help pay off all the legal expences incurred by the paedophiles.

I bet the charity thermometer is an unusual shape.

An octagon?! How could they?!

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(19th March 2011 05:19)Minimalist Wrote:  

Quote:because they sympathise with the perpertrators.

And because they need to protect the church's money from the victims.

^ Mostly this ^

[OnlyNatural]

(19th March 2011 06:26)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote:  How do you manage to fail suicide? It's easy enough to kill someone else... how can you possibly fail to commit suicide when you *try* to do it? 0.o

I can understand feeling suicidal and wanting to kill oneself and choosing not to for any number of reasons... but actually failing when one is attempting suicide? Were they physically incapable of killing themself? I just can't take that seriously otherwise.

Apparently you've never been severely depressed and suicidal, then. It may seem like an easy choice to you, either kill yourself or don't kill yourself. But the reality is a lot more complicated. You can't even begin to imagine the agonizing internal struggle that goes on in the mind of a suicidal person. Often there's a small part of them that is not sure about this and wants to be saved, wants help, while consciously they desperately want their suffering to end, so they may choose a method without a 100% success rate. And that's just one example.

When I attempted suicide, I swallowed 700 sleeping pills. You think that would do it. But my mother came home unexpectedly after an hour, and found me barely alive. So technically, I failed at suicide. But that doesn't minimize the fact that my suffering was so great that I saw no other option. Maybe the tiny part of me that thought 'maybe I shouldn't die at 17' is what kept me from jumping off a building (not to mention the paralysis and brain damage I'd be left with if I somehow survived such a 'serious' attempt, consequences which I desperately wanted to avoid).

Sorry, I just had to respond to this, it's an issue very close to home. Please try not to judge the depressed and suicidal unless you've been in their shoes. It's the closest thing to hell on Earth and there are no easy decisions or black-and-white explanations.

[Violet Lilly Blossom]

(19th March 2011 16:07)OnlyNatural Wrote:  Apparently you've never been severely depressed and suicidal, then. It may seem like an easy choice to you, either kill yourself or don't kill yourself. But the reality is a lot more complicated. You can't even begin to imagine the agonizing internal struggle that goes on in the mind of a suicidal person. Often there's a small part of them that is not sure about this and wants to be saved, wants help, while consciously they desperately want their suffering to end, so they may choose a method without a 100% success rate. And that's just one example.

Depressed and suicidal? I've beed so, though perhaps not so severely as you. But it really is easy to kill yourself. Hell: I spend much of my time when doing dangerous work specifically trying to *not* die. It really is easy to just step to the left two paces and be smashed between two full totes. It's easy to stab a knife straight through the throat. It's easy to fall off a building. I think it's more people's aversion to pain than anything else that stops these suicides

If you actually want to die: make darn sure you're going to succeed. If you don't want to die: don't try. Death is final, a half-measured approach is only going to hurt a lot.

Quote:When I attempted suicide, I swallowed 700 sleeping pills. You think that would do it. But my mother came home unexpectedly after an hour, and found me barely alive. So technically, I failed at suicide. But that doesn't minimize the fact that my suffering was so great that I saw no other option. Maybe the tiny part of me that thought 'maybe I shouldn't die at 17' is what kept me from jumping off a building (not to mention the paralysis and brain damage I'd be left with if I somehow survived such a 'serious' attempt, consequences which I desperately wanted to avoid).

Severe brain damage is death. I certainly would have thought that 700 sleeping pills would kill a person (or permanently damage them at least), though that is not the manner I would have chosen myself. I'm mildly cheerful that you failed though

Quote:Sorry, I just had to respond to this, it's an issue very close to home. Please try not to judge the depressed and suicidal unless you've been in their shoes. It's the closest thing to hell on Earth and there are no easy decisions or black-and-white explanations.

I've been in their shoes to an extent, but I always will view failure poorly (especially that of myself). I am not judging people who fail to commit suicide because they are depressed/suicidal... i am judging them because they failed... and failed something so easily accomplished as death.

[OnlyNatural]

(19th March 2011 22:02)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote:  If you actually want to die: make darn sure you're going to succeed. If you don't want to die: don't try. Death is final, a half-measured approach is only going to hurt a lot.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's rare to feel (when you're depressed) like you 100% want to die, or that you 100% don't want to die. Usually it's somewhere in between, and you're struggling with both options. And of course you're not thinking all that rationally, so you're conflicted and confused. That's my experience anyway.

(19th March 2011 22:02)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote:  I'm mildly cheerful that you failed though

Well thanks So am I, life definitely got better

(19th March 2011 22:02)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote:  I always will view failure poorly (especially that of myself). I am not judging people who fail to commit suicide because they are depressed/suicidal... i am judging them because they failed... and failed something so easily accomplished as death.

I judge myself harshly for failure as well. And there is definitely that shame when you fail to kill yourself, like 'why can't I just do ONE goddamn thing right, for once.' I agree that death is easily accomplished, but I just don't think it's an easy decision to make, it's a pretty agonizing one. Like, 'What will happen if I'm rescued? What about the pain I'll be causing my loved ones? What if things would've got better if I'd just waited? What if there's a God and I'm going to hell?' (well, I wouldn't be thinking THAT one anymore, at least )

[Violet Lilly Blossom]

(20th March 2011 00:08)OnlyNatural Wrote:  

(19th March 2011 22:02)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote:  If you actually want to die: make darn sure you're going to succeed. If you don't want to die: don't try. Death is final, a half-measured approach is only going to hurt a lot.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's rare to feel (when you're depressed) like you 100% want to die, or that you 100% don't want to die. Usually it's somewhere in between, and you're struggling with both options. And of course you're not thinking all that rationally, so you're conflicted and confused. That's my experience anyway.

[/quote]

I do not disagree that suicidal people are in serious emotional agony.

Quote:

(19th March 2011 22:02)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote:  I'm mildly cheerful that you failed though

Well thanks So am I, life definitely got better

Alas, there is no fast-forward button to life.

Quote:

(19th March 2011 22:02)Aerzia Saerules Arktuos Wrote:  I always will view failure poorly (especially that of myself). I am not judging people who fail to commit suicide because they are depressed/suicidal... i am judging them because they failed... and failed something so easily accomplished as death.

I judge myself harshly for failure as well. And there is definitely that shame when you fail to kill yourself, like 'why can't I just do ONE goddamn thing right, for once.' I agree that death is easily accomplished, but I just don't think it's an easy decision to make, it's a pretty agonizing one. Like, 'What will happen if I'm rescued? What about the pain I'll be causing my loved ones? What if things would've got better if I'd just waited? What if there's a God and I'm going to hell?' (well, I wouldn't be thinking THAT one anymore, at least )

Committing suicide doesn't necessarily mean you want to die... certain objectives can only be accomplished by death (protecting information that might otherwise be learned, use of body as a shield for someone/something else).

Death is only a difficult decision if you happen to value something else about as much as dying. I feel like both pizza and spaghetti, and both are available.... that is a difficult decision. Feel like pizza and not spaghetti? Easy choice. Feel like spaghetti and not pizza? Easy choice. Death is currently an easy choice for me (that being not to inflict it upon myself needlessly).

I've yet use for this bag of flesh, too soon to let it go