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The hijab (etc) is immodest
#51
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest
(January 25, 2020 at 7:52 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: In my opinion, people must have the freedom to live as they want unless they are causing harm to somebody else.
Physical harm is identifiable and easy to detect; while psychological harm must be conditioned to its physical conclusion -like causing depression to somebody via constant bullying-.
As long as no harm is caused; things can indeed change or stay the way they are.

Yes, good points. 

"Psychological harm" may be awfully hard to spot, in terms of direct cause-and-effect. And I imagine that when we're causing it our victim may well be trying hard not to show what's happening. 

Freud writes well about this in his Civilization and its Discontents. He points out that we can never reach a final healthy permanent balance. The tension between what society demands and what we want, and the tension among different things that we ourselves want, can't be resolved, only managed. 

But surely the main thing is to avoid inflicting harm when we can possibly avoid it.

Quote:People will rebel and get around anything forced on them, unless they are totally convinced with the rule implied. That's why I insist that freedom of choice is "a must".

I studied in a Saudi Wahhabi school and there weren't any girls. Boys resorted to homosexuality -just like the case in prisons-, they got around the rule of "no sex".

Sex is probably the best example. Decrees from above never work. 

Internalized rules, as you say, will operate more effectively. (Freud's description of the Superego is all about this.) I think peer pressure works because the shame it brings on is closer to an internal view than that caused by "higher authority." 

People in Japan often talk about "shame culture vs. guilt culture," where they say that Japanese society tends to be more orderly because it demands (or used to demand) group behavior. Roof-thatching or rice-planting can only be done by the whole village together, and so being ostracized is the worst thing. This contrasts to American culture, where everybody thinks he's Clint Eastwood. That's too simple to be true in every case, but I think it's a useful distinction.
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Messages In This Thread
The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrokenQuill92 - December 10, 2019 at 9:56 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Mister Agenda - December 10, 2019 at 10:18 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrokenQuill92 - December 10, 2019 at 10:20 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Abaddon_ire - January 20, 2020 at 5:50 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 20, 2020 at 6:47 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 17, 2022 at 6:17 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Brian37 - January 24, 2020 at 2:57 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 24, 2020 at 8:23 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 24, 2020 at 9:35 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 25, 2020 at 7:52 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 26, 2020 at 6:42 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 27, 2020 at 3:04 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 27, 2020 at 7:59 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 27, 2020 at 8:20 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 27, 2020 at 8:58 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 27, 2020 at 9:49 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 28, 2020 at 12:57 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 28, 2020 at 3:32 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 28, 2020 at 7:55 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 28, 2020 at 6:54 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - February 1, 2020 at 4:18 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - February 2, 2020 at 2:44 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - February 2, 2020 at 3:05 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - February 2, 2020 at 3:25 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - February 2, 2020 at 3:32 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - February 2, 2020 at 4:45 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 3:22 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 3:23 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Abaddon_ire - February 1, 2020 at 4:16 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 28, 2020 at 3:33 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 2:54 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Brian37 - January 25, 2020 at 12:43 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 25, 2020 at 1:46 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 25, 2020 at 3:15 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 25, 2020 at 3:53 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 25, 2020 at 4:17 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 26, 2020 at 12:49 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 2:37 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Mister Agenda - December 10, 2019 at 10:26 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Prycejosh1987 - January 20, 2020 at 4:34 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by LostLocke - January 23, 2020 at 10:07 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 9:34 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 20, 2020 at 5:41 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 17, 2022 at 5:49 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Paleophyte - January 20, 2020 at 7:00 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrokenQuill92 - January 21, 2020 at 8:29 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 21, 2020 at 6:36 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 23, 2020 at 7:16 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 17, 2022 at 6:22 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by arewethereyet - January 20, 2020 at 7:08 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 21, 2020 at 1:48 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 17, 2022 at 7:47 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 21, 2020 at 2:09 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 17, 2022 at 11:19 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - September 17, 2022 at 4:35 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 21, 2020 at 6:42 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Sal - January 23, 2020 at 8:32 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 23, 2020 at 10:00 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 24, 2020 at 3:01 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 24, 2020 at 4:46 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 24, 2020 at 6:03 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 24, 2020 at 6:49 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - January 24, 2020 at 7:09 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 24, 2020 at 9:05 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 2:04 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 24, 2020 at 11:06 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 9:20 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 23, 2020 at 8:59 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 24, 2020 at 7:45 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Sal - January 24, 2020 at 8:41 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - January 24, 2020 at 5:26 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 24, 2020 at 9:19 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Fake Messiah - January 24, 2020 at 9:56 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 24, 2020 at 10:53 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 24, 2020 at 11:12 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 24, 2020 at 12:11 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 24, 2020 at 12:52 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Mr Greene - January 24, 2020 at 8:34 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 25, 2020 at 5:32 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Mr Greene - January 25, 2020 at 4:51 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 26, 2020 at 5:05 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 26, 2020 at 11:11 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by R00tKiT - January 27, 2020 at 9:07 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 27, 2020 at 11:41 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 3:11 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by R00tKiT - September 18, 2022 at 6:09 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 2:14 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by R00tKiT - September 19, 2022 at 5:48 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 20, 2022 at 6:11 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by R00tKiT - September 20, 2022 at 3:45 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 21, 2022 at 12:10 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Rev. Rye - January 26, 2020 at 11:28 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 26, 2020 at 11:42 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Rev. Rye - January 26, 2020 at 11:51 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 27, 2020 at 12:53 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - January 27, 2020 at 9:45 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by R00tKiT - January 27, 2020 at 9:53 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - January 27, 2020 at 9:57 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by R00tKiT - January 27, 2020 at 10:18 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - January 27, 2020 at 10:20 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by R00tKiT - January 27, 2020 at 10:36 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - January 27, 2020 at 11:43 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 2:32 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 3:42 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 3:18 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 27, 2020 at 5:41 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 2:38 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 27, 2020 at 10:26 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - January 27, 2020 at 10:28 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 27, 2020 at 10:29 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 27, 2020 at 10:54 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 27, 2020 at 3:14 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 27, 2020 at 3:27 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 27, 2020 at 3:32 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 27, 2020 at 3:47 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 27, 2020 at 3:53 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 27, 2020 at 11:23 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - January 28, 2020 at 12:27 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 2:51 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Architect Of Fate - September 19, 2022 at 3:00 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 3:54 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - January 27, 2020 at 4:03 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - January 29, 2020 at 12:30 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - February 2, 2020 at 7:04 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by WinterHold - February 3, 2020 at 5:42 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - February 4, 2020 at 11:09 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Belacqua - February 5, 2020 at 6:42 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by EgoDeath - February 5, 2020 at 10:29 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - February 3, 2020 at 5:47 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - February 5, 2020 at 10:13 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 17, 2022 at 6:52 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 17, 2022 at 7:50 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 17, 2022 at 11:35 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Angrboda - September 18, 2022 at 3:40 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 18, 2022 at 3:48 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Angrboda - September 18, 2022 at 3:56 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 1:50 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 18, 2022 at 11:42 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Mister Agenda - September 19, 2022 at 11:27 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 2:16 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 19, 2022 at 4:29 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 20, 2022 at 5:56 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 20, 2022 at 6:14 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 20, 2022 at 6:43 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 20, 2022 at 7:24 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 19, 2022 at 3:51 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 19, 2022 at 2:10 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 19, 2022 at 3:51 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by arewethereyet - September 19, 2022 at 4:39 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 20, 2022 at 7:28 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by arewethereyet - September 20, 2022 at 10:04 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 20, 2022 at 12:49 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 21, 2022 at 11:33 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Eclectic - September 22, 2022 at 4:25 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by The Grand Nudger - September 21, 2022 at 12:00 pm
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - September 25, 2022 at 2:31 am
RE: The hijab (etc) is immodest - by Leonardo17 - October 2, 2022 at 2:54 pm

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