(October 11, 2021 at 12:13 pm)HappySkeptic Wrote:(October 10, 2021 at 12:09 am)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Isn’t that what order is: being disposed towards a definite end?
Hell no. There is no definite end. The universe isn't deterministic. If started identically 1000 times, it would evolve with subtle difference each time.
Order is simply a set of relationships. If there is no order, there cannot be structure to existence, as complexity requires relationships to form. With no relationships, there is no mathematics, no physics, no information, and no intelligence.
I would argue that without relationships, there is no way to even describe existence itself, or distinguish it from non-existence.
@Neo-Scholastic
I think Martha Nussbaum explains very clearly what Aristotle means by his four causes in this interview with Brian Magee. The part where she explains it begins at 27:15 and ends at 30:45... roughly 3 minutes. I think I set the video to start at the moment I'm speaking of, but I suck at that stuff, so you may have to do it manually.
I'm very interested in clearing up this fuzziness between physicists and Aristotle, because, as far as the four causes go, I don't think physicists should have a beef with Aristotle. He just uses his own (by now antiquated) nomenclature to describe nature. But it is in no way at odds with modern physics. Maybe I'm wrong there. I'd like to get HappySkeptic's opinion on things after hearing Nussbaum's take on the four causes.
I'd also like to hear if Neo agrees with Nussbaum's assessment.