To circumcise or not to circumcise?

[robvalue]

Aegon: I respect you taking the time to consider the information.

You say parents make decisions for their children all the time, and this is true. However, it's not the case that either parents make whatever decisions they want and we say "that's fine" (as a society); or they make no decisions. We can and do have a happy medium.

In the case of breast feeding versus formula, you can argue that using formula isn't optimal. But this really isn't the same as circumcision. The mother has to choose one or the other: breast or bottle. They are both methods for the same thing. The consequences of not acting are that the child will die.

With circumcision, if you do nothing, there are no significant consequences. There are some health benefits from doing it of course, but medical opinion still deems these not enough to do it as a matter of course, especially since there are very real balancing risks. So you are choosing to do something unnecessary. It's more akin to adding some sort of medicine to the child's food, which was considered to have significance and benefit in the past, but which you now know is not recommended, even after considering the possible benefits. Medicine that also causes some sort of irreversible change to the baby. The medicine may still be appropriate in certain cases, experts say, but that doesn't mean everyone should give it to their baby.

Sex is a squicky topic religious or no - it makes people uncomfortable to discuss. There's a lot of misinformation that gets perpetuated in all circles - including information about circumcision.

But it's not just the mechanics of sex that need to be explained - it's also body image and relationship health that should be promoted, and they don't do that either.

Yeah, I can understand that - not about circumcision cos that's just not a 'thing' here in the UK, not at all - but in general sex is still an uncomfortable topic for most people. And overall I think that is probably due to religious baggage down through the ages, but who knows whether it would still be the case even without religion. I know that I was very uncomfortable talking explicitly about sex in A69 when I first got to this site but now I'm more comfortable saying the sorts of things I've said in this thread... so this uncomfortableness can be challenged and overcome. So I thank AF for that... for opening me up hehe. But yeah, I'm all for being more open about sex and more realistic sex education all round. Especially about body image etc... as it is everyone's essentially isolated because of this fear of talking about it, leaving everyone to their own ignorance and delusions.

My wife's opinion is that our general taboo attitude towards sex here in England is left over from the Victorian era. We need to fuck that shit up and start educating our kids! I received precisely zero information and guidance from my parents, about both sex, sexuality, and the surrounding issues.

I don't think we should be too hard on people who have had their children circumcised.
I think we can generally except that it is a fact that none of them did it to be mean.
They may have been medically misguided or driven by cultural norms.

It seems to me that if there are medical benefits, it appears to be in the area of sexual health.
Given our level of understanding on the issue these days, maybe it would be better to wait until the child is of sexual age and let them make the decision/incision then.

I agree. If someone had the procedure done because they were medically advised to do so, I don't think badly of them. We put our trust in doctors, and in the medical opinions of experts. Opinions change as understanding improves. Some people have expressed regret for doing this, because they wouldn't do it now. But now is not then. However, people who continue to do it while ignoring new understanding are the ones I have a problem with.

Your baby is totally reliant on you to act in its best interest. How about not making unecessary, irreversible decisions on its behalf against the advice of experts? You like your dick how it is? Awesome, I'm happy for you. But please don't assume your child will simply agree with you about theirs.