Admitting You're a Sinner

[SteveII]

Usually a combination of pride, greed, lust, envy, gluttony, wrath and slothfulness which are foundations for a host of other less than perfectly moral actions. Are there people who have these under control without God (as in no desire to--not just avoid them)? I'm sure there are, but they would be rare exceptions, not the rule.

To all appearances xtians remain as prone to all those flaws as anyone else.  The big difference I see is that flawed atheists don't feel smugly that they're saved regardless.  An atheist dissatisfied with his life has a reason to get it together now in what for us is the only opportunity there will be.  For those planning on going to the pie in the sky place after death and content to call himself a sinner, why bother?

Sure, why wouldn't Christians be prone to those things? It is the human condition. My point is that a Christian should be working (or should want to work) with God on changing his/her heart so that these things are not struggles (not simply avoid the behavior). It seems your point in your last sentence is based on a poor understanding of Christianity, not based on any actual reasons from the belief system itself.

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47 years of experience with people. Is your position that there are a plenty of people who simply do not struggle with one or more of these things on a regular basis (which was my point)?

Then your experience is severely lacking. 

No, my position is not that people don't struggle with these on a regular basis. Don't try to twist it. The facts are, it's untrue that most atheists are powerless against these human conditions because they lack religion. Your confident assertion is misinformed and biased at best.

And you have to read more carefully. Read Khem's post again and my answer to it and tell me where I said atheists are powerless because they lack religion. I specifically further qualified my answer as well by saying "as in no desire to--not just avoid them". I stand by my point, people who can do this without God are rare. 

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Usually a combination of pride, greed, lust, envy, gluttony, wrath and slothfulness which are foundations for a host of other less than perfectly moral actions. Are there people who have these under control without God (as in no desire to--not just avoid them)? I'm sure there are, but they would be rare exceptions, not the rule.

Maybe it was just you?  Another question arises.  A person can certainly have a desire to do the right thing to the best of their ability -and- all of the above.  Wouldn't you agree?  This must be the state of all christians, at any rate.  Filled with both, and I doubt that's a "change" for anyone at all.

I would agree. It is not the state of all Christians--it should be the goal of all Christians, which is a very very big difference.