New Ager to Christian to Atheist

[Godscreated]

So, after the trip and 18 years it all came down to going to hell, you dumped Christianity over your fear of hell,

Not even close. The doctrine of hell was ONE of the things that i found myself wrestling with. Like I said, it's the Cliff's Notes version of the story.

You're welcome to ask questions about my journey, but please don't leap to unfounded conclusions.

Then you shouldn't leave out the important parts, Cliff's notes or not.

...why not the great and loving relationship with the Creator of the universe, that's a relationship that can't be had any other way except through Christ, wasn't this important...

Yes, it was. In fact, part of my journey was the rather unsettling discovery that this "relationship" can be and is found in other religions. In my travels, I had the opportunity to have long, searching conversations with Muslims, Pagans, Orthodox Jews and others - and their stories of the transcendent love of their respective deities were identical to the stories Christians tell.

I find that hard to believe no other god has died for the sins of those he created, "there's no greater love than having one to lay down his life for you."

Because I love to read and to learn, I eventually became fascinated with studies about how our brains work. It seems that there is an area in our brain which, if stimulated, causes ~70% of people to have a "religious experience." Add to this the dopamine rush we get from group activities (like singing or prayer), and you're a long ways towards explaining that apparently "supernatural" love.

The science of the brain is far from perfect and the understanding of the brain is even less. The more we study the brain, the more we know we don't know about it. Let's say for a moment that what you say is right, how is it you know for certain that God did not create the brain to function in this way, this would open up a way of experiencing our Creator.

You never stated why God told you to go to Israel and it seems that you ran from that mission, if it was one, because you got scared and lost trust in the God that supposedly sent you there.

That's quite a leap. It's also completely inaccurate. Cliff's Notes, remember? 35 years doesn't compress easily.

Then put in the important parts, when you leave out the basics of God's actions in our lives it gives me the idea you haven't really understood Christianity.

It seems to me that middle Tennessee was a destination you picked, why, because you never said God told you to leave Israel.

Again why leave out the important parts of God's actions in our lives, all you gave was your fear of a situation, you're leaving the impression you did not trust in the God you professed to believe in.

Again, Cliff's Notes. "God" told me to move to Nashville. And it's a good thing too, because I might never have come down off that acid trip if i had stayed among intelligent, well-educated Christian scholars in Israel. People there actually admitted that I was asking tough questions, instead of trying to shut me down.

Again why leave out the important parts of God's actions in our lives, all you gave was your fear of a situation. You're leaving the impression you did not trust in the God you professed to believe in. I've done the same here in East Tennessee, I know there are uneducated people in the churches of Tennessee, but is that a reason to say there's no God, the Nashville area is quite large and has more than one Christian university in the area, why did you not seek out these people. I have no idea what your attitude was with them, could that have been a reason for them to turn you off?

Your story is curious at best and not very believable at worst, not in the sense it didn't happen, but in the sense that you might have never been a Christian.

I wondered how long it would be until someone said that.

That I'm sure of and I'm sure everyone else was wondering too.

It's what I used to believe as a Christian, too.

Really, how personal was your relationship with God, did He make himself known to you, a way that left no doubts?

Even though the scriptures clearly teach otherwise, the Church says you can't be "truly saved' and then walk away. Why? Because they fear ex-Christians far more than simple heathens.

Strange that's the first time I've heard that from anyone, believer or not, I'm speaking of the fear of those who leave the church. You right, a person can be saved and leave the faith, however if one's truly saved one truly knows God and once you really know something is real how can you say it's not real, curious, very curious me thinks. Were you a Baptist, the Southern Baptist are the only ones I know who believe in once saved always saved, but this one doesn't.

You tell me, how is it that one can come to actually know God and then deny His existence,

Read your Bible. The end of Luke chapter 9, for example. Or the Pauline Epistles, specifically where he talks about those who have tasted the fruits of the kingdom and turned away. (I'd give you chapter and verse, but BibleGateway has made searching a lot harder recently).

Not necessary in this case, both those references are not dealing with those who know the reality of God, just because one tastes the fruit does not necessarily mean they will accept it as the real thing, free will is their justification to turn it down and so it should be. They however never knew the God of creation. Let's say they did know there's actually the God of scripture, like you stated they turned away, that doesn't mean they were denying God existed.

The Bible teaches that True BelieversTM can and do turn from "god." In fact, the people who selected and edited the books of the Bible were extremely clever, making certain to include lots of passages warning the faithful against former believers who dare to use rational thought to probe irrational doctrine.

Perceived rational thought. The scriptures teach us that it's a rational act to accept Christ as our savior. I'm at a disadvantage here I do not know where the scriptures say our beliefs are irrational. I know the scriptures say we could appear to be irrational to unbelievers, but that we're not irrational.

You should have come to East Tennessee and talked with my pastor who studies the scriptures from the Greek. This is another reason I find your story hard to believe, God wouldn't send you to a place where there was no one to teach you, He doesn't work that way.

Did you actually read my story? I speak Hebrew, dude! I studied Biblical Hebrew as well, and spent years among some of the foremost Biblical scholars in the world! I also learned how to study the scriptures from the Greek. There were dozens of people to teach me, and to answer - and honestly wrestle with - my questions.

I read it, and I know people can speak and read Hebrew, that in no way means you or they understand what God is saying to you/them. God makes things clear to me, even though there's no actual voice I can understand it in English. Pretty sure God's language isn't English, Hebrew or Greek and I know that we do not know the meaning of some of the Hebrew and Greek words in scripture. If these men were so smart why didn't they have an answer for you. There are many professors in Tennessee that are excellent in the Greek and Hebrew.

I lived in Jerusalem, and deliberately sought out teachers and scholars. Ones who were actually educated, not semi-literate backwoods pastors who studied Koine Greek in Podunk for a semester and think they can translate from the original.

Insulting those who could teach you many things about scripture isn't any way to get along with them, remember I asked what attitude you had with these pastor, it's no wonder they put off a self proclaimed Bible scholar.
My pastor was a nuclear engineer before God called him into the ministry, that backwoods pastor could school you in many areas of Christianity and I know a few others that can do the same. Some of the best Greek professors are in the Southern Baptist Church. Living in Jerusalem doesn't count for much.

I walked on streets where Jesus supposedly walked. I explored the archaeological layers beneath the streets of Jerusalem. I traveled the country for 7 years, and asked hard, probing questions of Biblical Archaeologists at digs in the Galil as well as the Negev. I was surrounded by teachers!

I went to school with many who were surrounded by teachers and they turned out to be idiots, they even asked questions in school, the answers were lost on them.
Here's how I've learned much from the scriptures, I traveled many years with teachers and never left East Tennessee, but most importantly I traveled through the scriptures with the One who gave them to man, big difference in our educations, I went directly to the source and many of my questions have been answered, still waiting on a few though, patience will bring the answers when I'm ready to understand the answers.

Ever heard of Origen? Justin Martyr? Polycarp? Clement of Rome? Augustine? Whatever you do, don't read what they had to say. You won't like it. Actually studying the first-century context of the New Testament is the last thing anyone should do if they want to remain a Christian.

I have no fear from them, nor you. Origen 150 years removed from Christ. Justin Martyr 100 years removed from Christ. Polycarp 90 years removed from Christ. Clement of Rome, knew Peter probably same age as Christ. Augustine 3 centuries removed from Christ. I have no fear of the words these men had, I know God actually exists, no doubts, no fears.

Don't examine the Books too closely, because (like any fantasy story) they don't hold together well under scrutiny.

The Bible has been attacked for many centuries and yet it still stands and that testifies to it's strength of truth.
That must have been some really bad acid to last 18 years, actually I believe it's still going strong, the best I ever got out of it was 12 hours. So a brain fried as badly as yours must hold some really weird notions at this time.

GC

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Yes it is, my father's family is from that area of NC. Are you going to ride the dragon all the way to Maryville, TN. Please be careful someone is killed on the dragon every year.

GC

I will, GC. It won't be my first ride on the dragon, but it will be my first two up on a Harley. Mom's family is from Tellico. Her mom's family is from Murphy, NC. I've been spending time in those mountains for more than 50 years now. I lived in the Tellico area for few years when I was younger, and in Farragut outside of Knoxville more recently so I know the area well.

This trip isn't fully planned out yet but would at least be from here to Tellico, across the Cherohala to Robbinsville, then on into Knoxville via the dragon. That's the short version. The long version would add down to to Townsend then 73 over to Gatlinburg before heading home.

We have somethings in common, I grew up in the Fountain City/ Inskip area of Knoxville, I now reside in Sevier county. I love those mountains though they are beginning to become to populated there are still some wild places left. Use to run the river a Franklin, NC in a kayak great fun when I was able to do that. I'm not a rider nor have I ever been, but if I had the dragon might have gotten me in the 70's or 80's, crazy years. I love Townsend still a place many tourist haven't found, hope it stays that way I like to trout fish over there. Gatlinburg ain't my cup of tea, though I've spent many days there, mostly to make the family happy or in my younger days to party. People who haven't been to the Dragon and Cherohala parts of TN/NC do not know the beauty they've missed.

GC