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The right to mis-define oneself
#37
RE: The right to mis-define oneself
(June 13, 2015 at 1:58 am)wallym Wrote: I'm definitely in the skeptical party that feels like we're being mandated to play pretend.  Bruce Jenner, for example, wants us to call him a her named Caitlyn.  Sure, whatever.  I don't give a shit.  But us all pretending he's a woman doesn't make him a woman in my mind.  

And here, I'm not pretending, which is why I'm using the wrong pronouns, which would get me labeled transphobic, which is silly.  I think the the obligation of others to 'play along' is an interesting social issue.

Perhaps my problem is that I'm pretty loose in my views of gender roles.  If you're a male who wants to wear a dress, go for it.  If you want to get fake tits, and get some type of vagina thing going, that's fine too.  Which complicates the transgender issue, because all that's left in my mind for what defines gender is the scientific assignment of sex.

So when Bruce says he wants to be Caitlyn, nothing about Caitlyn is anything I would deem as necessary to identify as a female to do.  It's all just superficial.

It costs me nothing at all to treat others the way they ask, in the case of TG/TS folks.  If they want me to refer to them by a specific set of gender pronouns, I'll do it until they start pushing the ridiculous.

For example, there's a TS on a guitar forum where I post, born male, going through gender reassignment. I'm happy to call her "her" as she asks ... but when she started ranting about men one day and capped it off by saying that "unlike us women, they'll never know what childbirth feels like", well, then I have to say spare me the bullshit and pass the apple-butter.

I don't mind addressing anyone as they wish, but I won't let a label be used to doctor reality.

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Messages In This Thread
The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 12, 2015 at 11:16 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by VeggieDog - June 12, 2015 at 11:30 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 12:05 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Lemonvariable72 - June 13, 2015 at 12:47 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 13, 2015 at 1:58 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 4:08 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 5:21 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 5:34 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Pyrrho - June 13, 2015 at 12:27 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 13, 2015 at 10:40 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Anomalocaris - June 13, 2015 at 4:13 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 4:33 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 5:22 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 5:38 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 5:24 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 5:36 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by robvalue - June 13, 2015 at 5:42 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 8:59 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 9:05 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 10:58 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Ravenshire - June 13, 2015 at 10:11 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 11:48 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Pyrrho - June 14, 2015 at 12:26 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:15 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 14, 2015 at 6:18 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:22 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 15, 2015 at 4:03 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by robvalue - June 13, 2015 at 5:27 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by comet - June 13, 2015 at 7:34 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Dystopia - June 13, 2015 at 7:36 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 8:57 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Iroscato - June 13, 2015 at 9:08 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 11:08 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 11:13 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 11:30 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 11:55 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 12:13 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 13, 2015 at 12:24 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 8:21 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Cato - June 13, 2015 at 8:45 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 11:47 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 12:02 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 12:14 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 3:29 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 4:23 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 4:53 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 1:01 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Cato - June 14, 2015 at 10:56 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 5:53 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 6:00 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:03 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 6:10 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:20 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 6:47 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 7:43 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 8:17 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 9:01 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 15, 2015 at 1:26 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 9:29 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 15, 2015 at 12:21 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 4:05 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 17, 2015 at 1:03 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 14, 2015 at 6:36 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Nope - June 13, 2015 at 10:41 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 13, 2015 at 11:51 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 13, 2015 at 10:55 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 3:34 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 4:29 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 4:37 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 14, 2015 at 11:15 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 11:20 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 14, 2015 at 11:47 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 1:04 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:00 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 15, 2015 at 12:54 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 15, 2015 at 4:01 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 14, 2015 at 5:07 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 7:00 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 7:02 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 1:03 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Nope - June 13, 2015 at 10:34 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 13, 2015 at 10:45 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 12:09 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 3:25 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 4:20 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Dystopia - June 16, 2015 at 6:54 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 16, 2015 at 1:52 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Dystopia - June 16, 2015 at 2:01 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 16, 2015 at 2:16 pm
The right to mis-define oneself - by KUSA - June 13, 2015 at 10:26 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 13, 2015 at 10:50 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 13, 2015 at 11:42 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 13, 2015 at 10:43 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 12:18 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 12:23 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 12:52 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 1:36 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 1:41 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 4:19 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by rexbeccarox - June 14, 2015 at 6:10 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:52 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 6:17 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 14, 2015 at 11:30 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 14, 2015 at 11:45 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 14, 2015 at 3:19 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 11:45 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 5:55 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Bad Wolf - June 14, 2015 at 1:55 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 2:24 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Bad Wolf - June 14, 2015 at 2:47 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 2:56 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Bad Wolf - June 14, 2015 at 3:15 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 14, 2015 at 3:19 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 14, 2015 at 4:23 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:10 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Cato - June 14, 2015 at 5:56 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 6:01 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 14, 2015 at 6:53 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 7:20 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 7:47 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 14, 2015 at 7:46 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 7:55 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 8:05 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 8:28 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 15, 2015 at 4:07 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 6:39 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 14, 2015 at 8:20 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 8:32 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 8:39 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 9:13 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 10:04 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 10:33 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by rexbeccarox - June 14, 2015 at 10:13 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 10:47 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 10:46 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 10:57 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 10:53 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 10:58 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 15, 2015 at 1:33 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 14, 2015 at 11:08 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 14, 2015 at 11:43 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 15, 2015 at 12:30 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 12:48 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 12:49 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 15, 2015 at 1:43 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by robvalue - June 15, 2015 at 9:54 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 15, 2015 at 1:35 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by SteelCurtain - June 15, 2015 at 2:17 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 15, 2015 at 4:25 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 15, 2015 at 4:28 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 15, 2015 at 4:40 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 15, 2015 at 4:59 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 16, 2015 at 2:26 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Dystopia - June 16, 2015 at 6:55 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by robvalue - June 16, 2015 at 7:00 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 16, 2015 at 2:03 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 16, 2015 at 2:15 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 16, 2015 at 2:51 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 16, 2015 at 2:56 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 16, 2015 at 2:28 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 16, 2015 at 2:49 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 16, 2015 at 3:13 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 6:14 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 16, 2015 at 11:04 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 17, 2015 at 1:57 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 11:21 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by rexbeccarox - June 16, 2015 at 11:43 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 17, 2015 at 12:26 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 16, 2015 at 11:25 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by rexbeccarox - June 17, 2015 at 12:59 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 17, 2015 at 8:37 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 17, 2015 at 8:40 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 17, 2015 at 10:46 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by I_am_not_mafia - June 17, 2015 at 2:03 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by robvalue - June 17, 2015 at 8:50 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 19, 2015 at 10:12 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 19, 2015 at 10:26 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 19, 2015 at 7:36 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 19, 2015 at 8:09 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by henryp - June 19, 2015 at 8:05 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 19, 2015 at 9:10 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Regina - June 19, 2015 at 10:32 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2015 at 10:37 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 19, 2015 at 11:01 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2015 at 11:10 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 20, 2015 at 6:07 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 11:16 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Longhorn - June 20, 2015 at 6:09 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 20, 2015 at 6:13 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 20, 2015 at 12:29 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 20, 2015 at 7:42 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 11:23 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 20, 2015 at 9:41 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 21, 2015 at 11:11 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 21, 2015 at 11:21 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 21, 2015 at 11:27 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 4:59 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 5:34 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 5:43 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 5:37 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 5:38 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 5:45 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 21, 2015 at 8:16 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 21, 2015 at 11:40 pm
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 22, 2015 at 12:21 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by The Grand Nudger - June 22, 2015 at 12:26 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by paulpablo - June 22, 2015 at 2:39 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by Thumpalumpacus - June 22, 2015 at 1:58 am
RE: The right to mis-define oneself - by bennyboy - June 22, 2015 at 8:56 am

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