RE: Question about meaning and perception of reality from a theist.
January 6, 2012 at 3:08 pm
(This post was last modified: January 6, 2012 at 3:12 pm by Perhaps.)
(January 6, 2012 at 3:00 pm)Shell B Wrote:(January 6, 2012 at 2:53 pm)amkerman Wrote: Here I'll set up the argument again and someone can try to knock it down, again.
All of reality is experienced through consciousness.
THEREFORE: If you believe in reality you must believe consciousness is real.
Eh, wrong. Killed it right there. No one must believe anything. You are operating under a heap of delusions.
1. That because you think it, other people must.
2. Experience=reality.
3. That reality requires anything as silly as a belief in it.
4. That's what real is not real unless you are experiencing it.
I know lifetime psychedelic drug users who would laugh at the absurdity of your assertions. You are jumping to "therefore" without every explaining why.
Yes, we experience reality through consciousness. That's as far as you got. It all fell apart on its own. No one has to knock it down. It is your delusion.
Perhaps, go "be the toaster" or something.
For the sake of an interesting conversation:
If you can make the claim that we experience reality, then you should be able to assert that reality is real. Correct?
From this you are then able to say that if reality is real because I experienced it, what allowed me to experience it? If that answer is consciousness then you are able to assume that the realness of reality presupposes consciousness existing. If something exists it is real by definition. We can continue from there I suppose.
[Edit] Shell, I don't think you need to be as harsh with him as you are being. Its a simple argument, it shouldn't include the person's character.
Brevity is the soul of wit.