Experiencing 'proof'

[Cinjin]

Is there an echo in here? I could swear I heard this sermon yesterday, and the day before, and the day before, and the day before, and the day before, and the day before, and....................................................

You would think after this long he'd have figured out that we're onto his strongest argument:

*sigh

[Gambit]

Drich, if nothing else, you have inspired the topic of my next article. I was going to post it as a response to your general assumption that we give a shit about your defense of your god and his abhorrent actions; however, I know it would fall on deaf ears. Basically, explaining why Yahweh is such a complete and utter asshole is never going to win any converts, unless they are already inclined towards becoming sadomasochistic assholes. This is where you completely miss the point with every one of these stupid threads - even if god did exist, we still wouldn't like him because he is a dick.

[Darkstar]

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The Idea of a magic/mystical God came out of the dark ages. Where God by decree of the pope God Had to be completely unknowable by everyone but the church/pope. The fact of the matter is He is not unknowable, infact He goes through great lengths, so we can infact know God. That is why I harp on Luke 11 and A/S/K so much. God literally offers to come and work in your life, and show you the 'proof' YOU need to establish a solid faith. However their is a catch. You have to do things his way, and if you want these experiences to increase you have to be faithful to what he has shown you already.

Meaning If God shows you a deal breaking sin in your life that is keeping Him from fully working with you, and you do nothing about it then know, that the 'guilt' you feel is all you will ever know of the Holy Spirit. Now, if you are faithful to what He has shown you and you continue to a/s/k then you will be given More to work with. God will take whatever you put into this relationship and turn over 10 fold, if you take the 10 He will inturn multiply that blessing 10 more times. God has no upper limit, so whatever you experience is only limited by what you are willing to give of yourself.

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Faithful to what he has shown us already... You mean like nothing? Many people have sought god and not found him. Asking people to go on a wild goose chase and just have faith that god exists is ridiculous. Maybe if god gave us something in the first place we would know where to start.

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funny how he opened this thread and then went offline, as if his subconciousness was screaming from the back of his head:"turn it off now!" "so you dont have to whitness your own humiliation!"

He's still off... you may be onto something...but, he thinks his nuclear meltdown of an argument is valid, so maybe he isn't hiding but actually thinks he made good points...

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Your "work" here is done.

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At this point, it is more like this:

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[Reasonable_Jeff]

Isn't he just stating the argument from religious experience but in more words?

Something like:

1. When people experience X they have good reason to believe X exists unless they have reason to think otherwise. (Experiences are treated as innocent until proven guilty)
2. Experiences occur which seem to their subjects to be of God.
3. There are no good reasons for thinking all or most experiences which seem to their subjects to be of God are delusive.
4. It is rational to believe that at least some experiences which seem to their subjects to be of God really are experiences of God.
5. It is rational to believe that God exists.

[Something completely different]

3. There are no good reasons for thinking all or most experiences which seem to their subjects to be of God are delusive.

So if you were in the jury of a courtcase, in which a woman is trialed because she murdered her children - because, on her own testemony "god told her so" - would you consider her to be: not guilty?

[Darkstar]

Isn't he just stating the argument from religious experience but in more words?

Something like:

1. When people experience X they have good reason to believe X exists unless they have reason to think otherwise. (Experiences are treated as innocent until proven guilty)

Yeah, we can all agree: Drich did indeed experience a dream.

2. Experiences occur which seem to their subjects to be of God.

As do alleged alien abductions.

3. There are no good reasons for thinking all or most experiences which seem to their subjects to be of God are delusive.

Really? I don't think there is any good reason to think any of them are not delusive. A dream proves nothing but that someone had a dream. If I dream of a talking dog does this provide evidence that there is a talking dog somewhere? If I dream of alins who telepathically send dreams into people's heads of them sending dreams into other people's heads does this provide evidence that the source of the dream is said alien? No, it would be absurd to think so, and yet gos, as always, gets a "get out of scrutiny free" pass. ("get out of scrutiny free pass"...I think I'm going to hang onto that one)

4. It is rational to believe that at least some experiences which seem to their subjects to be of God really are experiences of God.
5. It is rational to believe that God exists.

No it isn't and no it isn't. You seem to be making an argument ad populum. "That many people couldn't be wrong!" When, in fact, there is no actual evidence that any of these experiences are anything more than what they are scientifically demonstrated to be.

[Cyberman]

Jeff, you might wish to re-evaluate your rationalisation, in particular your step three where it goes off the rails.

[The Grand Nudger]

My favorite.

There are many people who dream about fucking Jessica Rabbit. Surely it's reasonable to believe at least some of these people are actually fucking Jessica Rabbit.

[Cyberman]

Jessica Rabbit's fucking behind my back?! I'm going to have a few words with the cheating little skank next time I see her...

[Something completely different]

I have to admit that at first, I think Drich really fucked with my mind.

Expirience translates to Erfahrung - which is more a technical and scientific term in our language.

No one here would actualy call a dream a "expirience" since expirience\Erfahrung is a term reserved for "expiriences" out which one has learned lessons.
One is a good engeneer because of long time work expirience. for example.

Or is the use of the term "expirience" the same in english and Drich is the one whos mind is fucked?