Britian knows how to put bigot Christians in their place

[Raven]

rexbeccarox wrote:

And, you realize that there are a lot of different people on this forum, and that the term "atheist" has absolutely nothing to do with political views, right?

But I never said anything about atheists. Seems to me that this little disagreement between yourself and myself is an excellent example of what you are trying to say. You, as a small business owner, want to be able to "run your business as you wish" . I can understand that. I also am against it. To me, it being a place of public accommodation trumps that. There is room for both of us on this forum. I was not attacking you. I just disagree.

Or is that not alright?

[Tiberius]

Yes they are serving the public but they are doing it via a private business. It's totally different when the public sector discriminates, because the public sector is government run and the government is supposed to treat people equally.

The private sector has no such requirement, which is why in England up until very recently, we had car insurance companies that only insured women (because women are thought to be better drivers) and the ones that served men too often gave better rates to women. Was it discrimination? Certainly. Should it have been outlawed? I don't think so.

I believe it is education and a developing society that removes discrimination, not laws. I can't prove it, but the fact that the US passed the Civil Rights Act to me demonstrates that they were at a point of societal change, and if the Civil Rights Act had not been put into law, we'd still see a similar country today. Racists didn't suddenly stop being racist because some law stopped them from discriminating.

[Raven]

What you say is true enough, but the Civil Rights Act came about with quite a lot struggle. America isn't particularly civilized. Racists are not uncommon, and incidents happen frequently. They just don't get reported other than locally all that much. That's why NYPD has been doing "stop and frisk", which is a gross violation of civil rights. That's why Trayvon Martin got shot. And it is not just racism. We've "isms" to spare here. During the pre Civil Rights Act Freedom Rides the non-violent demonstrators were attacked with dogs, high pressure hoses and clubs. A black church was blown up.


Many in this country were not ready for the societal change you are speaking about. We're a country where "right-to-lifers" murder abortion doctors. We're a little meshugga here. Maybe we watched too many Westerns or something.

Nobody is of the opinion that passing laws is going change how people think. But we can make what actions they do because they have their head up their ass illegal. They have to serve that cup of coffee.

[rexbeccarox]

Raven, you asked if we were "getting all libertarian" or something, and this being an atheist forum, I felt I needed to point out that not everyone here shares the same political views.

Also, no, private businesses, for the most part have the right to run their businesses the way they see fit. Public works don't. You see the difference, right? It's kind of like the cake shop down the street is allowed to have a nativity scene but the courthouse isn't.

And, what on earth does this mean?

There is room for both of us on this forum. I was not attacking you. I just disagree.

Or is that not alright?

I never felt like I was being attacked, but the fact that you said it makes me think you were trying to attack. I completely respect your right to disagree, I'm just not sure you respect mine.

[Chad32]

A private business means that someone owns the building. It's not like a park or something that's owned by the government. If someone came to my house, and did something I didn't like, I can kick them out because I own the place.

[Chas]

Hey, if you want to lose business by denying people, I say go ahead. I'm sure they can spend their money elsewhere, and other businesses will be happy to take them. If this was a widespread issue, though, I would agree that something needed to be done.

It was a widespread issue and something was done.

It's called civil rights. There are anti-dscrimination laws.

[rexbeccarox]

It's called civil rights. There are anti-dscrimination laws.

Yes... anti discrimination laws for public works!

I'm sorry I'm getting so frustrated here, guys, but this is an extremely intelligent forum, and I can't get people to understand the difference between "public" and "private". I understand it's a hot-button issue, and believe me, I get worked up about discrimination too, but this is a really simple concept!

You don't have to agree with my views, in fact, maybe I'm wrong... I'm always willing to explore the possibility... but can we please get past this part?

[Foxaèr]

Even private enterprises should be held accountable for discrimination. It being a private business does not excuse it from discrimination.

[rexbeccarox]

Even private enterprises should be held accountable for discrimination. It being a private business does not excuse it from discrimination.

As most laws stand now, yes, it does.

[NoraBrimstone]

So what other laws does this apply to? Would Sweeney Todd be allowed to run his barber shop in peace?