Can Consciousness Best Be Explained by God's Existence?

[Esquilax]

How does god explain consciousness, pray tell? Do we have a mechanism as to how god creates consciousness? A recipe of its composition? An understanding of why it was formed the way it was as opposed to a different way, say, one with less cognitive biases? What information do we currently have about god that explains consciousness at all?

None? So when you say god explains consciousness, all you're really saying is "this is the thing that does the things that solves problems I don't have an answer to." That's not very compelling.

Seriously, explanations are more than just "X does it." Gravity explains why things fall down, but if our understanding of gravity was just "mass does it," and that's it, then I have a hard time seeing anybody accepting it as valid.

[houseofcantor]

Can the moon best be explained by the Death Star's existence?



In other news, I reads the title and go, "meh. Just a bunch of math from here." And then I see element five posting a link to a buncha math. So, there it is.

[Chas]

The conclusion that for our consciousness to exist requires a greater sentient being (God) leads to infinite regress. God's consciousness requires a God', God' requires a God'' and so on.

So, no, it's an absurd conclusion.

[Angrboda]

One of the main problems being there just isn't enough specificity to "god as an explanation" for it to tell us very much. Lacking more specifics, it becomes a non-starter. If you start adding the specifics of this or that god, it quickly becomes apparent that there are not good, rational reasons for adding this specific rather than that specific, this god rather than that god, and the whole explanation collapses in on itself for lack of evidence for the particulars.

One must laugh at the irony of that post, given that you yourself claim to believe in various particular gods. (Or are you not a theist?)

Various gods? I've made it clear I worship one god. That you don't even know what I believe and yet you think yourself fit to criticize is pathetic and stupid.

That you think the only way to worship one's god is to be a shameless lickspittle and bend the truth to the service of one's deity at every opportunity, that's something else altogether.

[tor]

The answer is no.

[truthBtold]

One must laugh at the irony of that post, given that you yourself claim to believe in various particular gods. (Or are you not a theist?)

Various gods? I've made it clear I worship one god. That you don't even know what I believe and yet you think yourself fit to criticize is pathetic and stupid.

That you think the only way to worship one's god is to be a shameless lickspittle and bend the truth to the service of one's deity at every opportunity, that's something else altogether.

Who named ur god,god?

[MindForgedManacle]

^What are you saying man? Are you saying:

"Who named your god 'God'?", because I don't think Rasetsu worships the Abrahamic deity, or else she'd be a pretty interesting Hindu. Then again, I'm pretty sure I saw a book at my local library about a Christian-Buddhist (or was it a Buddhist-Christian?), so fuck if I know anything about "Eastern" religions and traditions. :3

[truthBtold]

^What are you saying man? Are you saying:

"Who named your god 'God'?", because I don't think Rasetsu worships the Abrahamic deity, or else she'd be a pretty interesting Hindu. Then again, I'm pretty sure I saw a book at my local library about a Christian-Buddhist (or was it a Buddhist-Christian?), so fuck if I know anything about "Eastern" religions and traditions. :3

I know she doesnt worship the christian god.

[Angrboda]

From Hamza's opening statement:

"From this neurochemical activity you can never, ever find out what it is like to be Hamza eating a strawberry ... This is the hard problem of consciousness as Chalmers explains."

"Let me summarize my argument:
1. subjective conscious experiences can be best explained by materialist, theist, or other worldviews.
2. subjective conscious experiences cannot be explained by materialist or other competing worldviews.
Therefore subjective conscious experience is best explained by theism."

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This is an obvious argument from ignorance. That you, Rayaan, would consider this argument compelling, tells us more about your inadequacies than it does about the hard problem.

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"Why have biological explanations failed to explain the hard problem of consciousness ... 3. [they suggest] subjective experience is explained by the physical processes in our brain... but this sounds like magic, hocus pocus..."

And there's the argument from incredulity, right on time.

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Hamza's entire argument for a theistic origin of consciousness is as follows:
1. theism explains where consciousness came from [another conscious being, God]
2. theism explains how consciousness entered the physical world
3. theism has a greater explanatory power
4. theism explains the interaction between the physical and the non-physical [God's will and power allows this to take place...]
5. theism explains the ability for us to have inner subjective consciousness experiences [if God is aware, it makes sense that he would make us aware]

I don't think I need to repeat my earlier objection that this doesn't provide an explanation of consciousness and is basically empty. I'll note he also misrepresents explanatory power in 3; the theist explanation has near zero explanatory power; it does nothing to illuminate efficient causes.

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I haven't watched beyond Hamza's opening, nor do I intend to, given the obvious vacuity of Hamza's entire argument.

[Alex K]

Consciousness has got to be the most overrated concept ever. It is uttered, and as if it were the most obvious thing since the insight that water is wet, we nod and agree what deep mystery it is.

Let me ask you something: we all use this word - how do we know what is meant by it? It's not like it can be pointed to, or explained by comparison.