Why are Atheists afraid to insult Islam and Jews?

[Cephus]

No one else here said Moslems should act American or leave. That's why Min was singled out. Hiding racism behind atheism like he does is complete garbage.

Islam is not a race.

And anyone who thinks Islam is a race is an idiot.

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Islam isn't a race.

Neither is Judaism, for that matter.

Actually, Judaism can be a race, there are plenty of people who are ethnically Jewish, it is a distinct and recognized group.  It is also a religion and a culture.  Islam isn't a race in any way, shape or form.

[Brian37]

I think you need to check your sample rate. I myself am a flaming social and economic liberal. But, at the same time I also have a huge problem with political correctness. 

I love my well intended friends on the left, but what they do not understand is that the same books they may read to justify empathy, are the same books with the same words that others use to justify cruelty.

Humans deserve rights, but ideas should never be given blind value or be blasphemy free. 

I do criticize Muslims and Jews and Hindus and will also Buddhist and go after atheists who I think get it wrong. 

One huge problem I have with ALL religions and they all pull this crap, when you tell them it is not a race they flip out. I have seen Muslims and Jews especially when you point out religion being the cause of their needless conflict they cay "no it is not a religion it is a race".

A black Muslim in Africa does not look like a olive complected Muslim say in Turkey or Pakistan. Had a Hindu once accused me of racism because I simply said his religion was not any different than anyone elses and just as made up. Despite pointing out to him Indian atheist groups whom have people born there with the same backgrounds and skin complexions.

I don't expect the population of Israel to move, but to me their land grabs are no different than what European Christians did to Native Americans when they migrated here. On the other side only a fool would claim that Islam isn't the backers of the idea of wiping Israel off the map. And if "Jew" were a race then why doesn't Israel's population look like Sammy Davis Jr.

And a few months ago there was a story out of Israel where their right wing sexist nuts held a flight back 11 hours becuase those fuckwads refused to sit next to women.

And stupid things like male or female genital mutilation which all three do. And thinking dietary rules handed to you by a god, like eating fish on friday(Christianity) or abstaining from pork because you are Jewish or Muslim or not eating cow because you are Hindu, is just flat out superstitious bullshit.

I go after atheists too. I know Aynd Rand ass kissers who are atheists who would love us to look like a 3rd world country masturbating over cheap labor. I know other atheists who think getting rid of the private sector on a planet of 7 billion is a good goal. I know other atheists who have conspiracy crap like 9/11 and JFK.

I personally wish all three religions would stop using the only home I have as their giant pissing contest. But everyone is fair game to me, not out to silence anyone, just saying no one deserves a pedestal.

While I agree with much of your sentiment, there is a certain degree of ideological arrogance implied by these words. Basically, you've narrowed it down to saying (without saying) everyone besides progressive democrats are stupid and have a substandard ideology. 

In my mind, it's not all that unreasonable to think that the existence of federal regulatory agencies makes corruption of our political system inevitable, and so the idea of simply getting rid of them, isn't so outlandish or stupid. Indeed, maybe it is better to simply regulate via case law, instead of limiting the right of citizens to sue tortfeasors (as federal regulation does under the supremacy clause), why not abolish these agencies, which would have the effect of making every lawyer, every judge in the country, a potential regulator (much more difficult to bribe millions of attorneys, particularly when the payout for winning a lawsuit against a huge company can be so big). 

As a veteran (who has used the VA on numerous occasions), I think rather than funding the giant mind numbing, psychologically assaulting bureaucracy that is the VA, vets would be far better off if we simply gave them private medical insurance. And why should the post office be allowed to retain a monopoly on first class mail anyway? 

I'm not saying I agree with any of this (for the most part, I don't, I actually think there's better ways to deal with corruption at both the agency and political level), but none of this is unreasonable or stupid. Indeed, the only thing that's stupid, is tribalistic partisanship!

Pick any single claim as an example you think is the height of the worst "arrogance" you think I am committing and I will demonstrate that bluntness does not mean "arrogance". You will NEVER hear me claim I know everything. I don't. That list above is not my "arrogance" . It is simple a list of stupid things humans blindly swallow that in reality are merely things they like believing. 

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Oh and don't blame dems for the VA, you can thank republicans for budget cuts so they can give tax breaks for the rich. You can blame the GOP for protecting right wing religious nuts and plutocrats.

[robvalue]

I can sum up most of my problems with religion in three words:

Faith is stupid.

[nihilistcat]

While I agree with much of your sentiment, there is a certain degree of ideological arrogance implied by these words. Basically, you've narrowed it down to saying (without saying) everyone besides progressive democrats are stupid and have a substandard ideology. 

In my mind, it's not all that unreasonable to think that the existence of federal regulatory agencies makes corruption of our political system inevitable, and so the idea of simply getting rid of them, isn't so outlandish or stupid. Indeed, maybe it is better to simply regulate via case law, instead of limiting the right of citizens to sue tortfeasors (as federal regulation does under the supremacy clause), why not abolish these agencies, which would have the effect of making every lawyer, every judge in the country, a potential regulator (much more difficult to bribe millions of attorneys, particularly when the payout for winning a lawsuit against a huge company can be so big). 

As a veteran (who has used the VA on numerous occasions), I think rather than funding the giant mind numbing, psychologically assaulting bureaucracy that is the VA, vets would be far better off if we simply gave them private medical insurance. And why should the post office be allowed to retain a monopoly on first class mail anyway? 

I'm not saying I agree with any of this (for the most part, I don't, I actually think there's better ways to deal with corruption at both the agency and political level), but none of this is unreasonable or stupid. Indeed, the only thing that's stupid, is tribalistic partisanship!

Pick any single claim as an example you think is the height of the worst "arrogance" you think I am committing and I will demonstrate that bluntness does not mean "arrogance". You will NEVER hear me claim I know everything. I don't. That list above is not my "arrogance" . It is simple a list of stupid things humans blindly swallow that in reality are merely things they like believing. 

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Oh and don't blame dems for the VA, you can thank republicans for budget cuts so they can give tax breaks for the rich. You can blame the GOP for protecting right wing religious nuts and plutocrats.

I don't blame dems or repubs for the VA. I blame the simple fact that large, centralized bureaucracies are almost always inefficient, because bureaucracy seems to beget more bureaucracy, it piles on over time, and ultimately it becomes a monstrosity.

Similarly, we see the same dynamic in large centralized companies (unfortunately, libertarian types never want to admit that private companies can become overcentralized and run into an economic calculation problem just as government bureaucracies can). But the fact is, companies have been able to co-opt federal regulatory power, and use the coercive power of state to its advantage. We're all familiar with how this manifested in our banking industry, but it permeates throughout our economy and government. 

Command and control bureaucracies (whether public or private) suck (this has been thoroughly demonstrated over the last century or so). There's exceptions to this rule. For instance, if the function we're asking a bureaucracy to perform is relatively simple, then it can be effective e.g. the only job the social security administration has to do is parse through claims, but otherwise, money in money out (simple). But when the function is complex (like say operating a nationwide healthcare system) ... that's when it becomes disastrous. Medicare is another example of a manageable bureaucracy. It's role is to simply cut checks to doctors and hospitals, and collect tax revenue (but actually it doesn't even do that ... the IRS collects the taxes, and the treasury sends HHS the money). And of course we can distinguish the 'payer' function from the healthcare provider function.

But libertarian types make a fair point. Agencies like the EPA are no longer doing things like cleaning up superfund sites, they've become clearinghouses for crony capitalism. And to make it worse, because federal regulation dominates the field, state tort suits are unavailable to would be plaintiffs. So this has created a situation where companies have convenient one stop shopping for cronyism. Same is true of the FDA, SEC, DHS, etc. etc. Now we could fix the lawsuit problem through simple legislation (without eliminating these agencies), but at the same time, I don't think it's necessarily unreasonable to endorse cutting these agencies. And oh btw, there's a reason why dems aren't calling for the type of legislation that would fix this problem. They like the power these agencies give them (they get to shake down companies and basically extort political patronage). So IMO dems are no better than repubs as far as economic issues go. Yeah, they are more socially liberal, but what good will social liberalism be when we're all living in squalor because of crooked trade deals, cronyism, and all the rest? So I no longer call myself a democrat & frankly, with only one or two exceptions, I could care less if dems win. I'd even say that America's best days are behind her if we do not figure out a way to fix this mess.

[Brian37]

Um no, it isn't about size it is about one party cutting funding.

You talk about all that paperwork, and long waits no shit. That is no different than when a boss in a private business buys crappy material and keeps the place short staffed.

You do understand that representative government means that as the population grows the government has to to represent that population. If America never added House or Senate members when the ink was dry on the Constitution and made it law that no more would be added, and it stayed that way till today, the vast majority of the United States as it is now would look like Somalia. The GOP isn't worried about big government, they are worried about their corporate sponsors.

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The corruption is our growing plutocracy, not government itself.

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Duke energy in my state allowed coal ash to leak into local rivers. No one as far as I know went to prison over it. The fine was a slap on the wrist. Just like I don't believe BP when they say they are working to prevent another gulf spill. In fact they are looking to drill even deeper. And why the fuck are we still burning oil at all, we have had solar technology for almost a century, you don't have to dig or drill for sunlight.

We don't have a majority of solar power, not because it cannot be done, it is because of rich oil ceo's don't want to do the right thing.



If you want to claim the regulators are bought off, it would not be by democrats outside our politicians being too compromising for too long.

[nihilistcat]

Um no, it isn't about size it is about one party cutting funding.

You talk about all that paperwork, and long waits no shit. That is no different than when a boss in a private business buys crappy material and keeps the place short staffed.

You do understand that representative government means that as the population grows the government has to to represent that population. If America never added House or Senate members when the ink was dry on the Constitution and made it law that no more would be added, and it stayed that way till today, the vast majority of the United States as it is now would look like Somalia. The GOP isn't worried about big government, they are worried about their corporate sponsors.

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The corruption is our growing plutocracy, not government itself.

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Duke energy in my state allowed coal ash to leak into local rivers. No one as far as I know went to prison over it. The fine was a slap on the wrist. Just like I don't believe BP when they say they are working to prevent another gulf spill. In fact they are looking to drill even deeper. And why the fuck are we still burning oil at all, we have had solar technology for almost a century, you don't have to dig or drill for sunlight.

We don't have a majority of solar power, not because it cannot be done, it is because of rich oil ceo's don't want to do the right thing.



If you want to claim the regulators are bought off, it would not be by democrats outside our politicians being too compromising for too long.

I've been using the VA since 2006, and it hasn't gotten any better or worse during that period. But I did just look at a graph that charts funding for the VA, which ran up until 2009, and there was year to year growth in funding each and every single year (so there were no cuts in VA funding). In fact I also just found a Washington Post article that stated the sequester did not cut funding for the VA, so there hasn't even been any recent cuts to VA funding (it's really easy to fact check this stuff, we have this magical thing called Google, in fact I always fact check before I post something I'm unsure of, a great habit to get into). In fact I'm not even siding with republicans (I'd almost certainly be classified as a socialist by any good red meat loving, gay bashing, gas guzzling republican).

Nonetheless, I find your posture wholly reactionary. 

Of course oil interests are fighting against alternative energy, of course banking interests are fighting against financial regulations, of course telecommunications companies are fighting against things like net neutrality, what do you expect? Indeed, our corporate laws in this country require as much. The duty of managers is to increase shareholder value, that's it. CEO's get paid to make stock holders richer ... that's our system. Yet you will not hear either dems or repubs attack those sort of basic underlying aspects of our system, and why? Because it's the gift that keeps on giving. I mean, if you think that democrats are not feeding off the piggy bank just like republicans are, then I don't know what to say. I don't like arguing over this shit, because it's mostly pointless. But anyone who thinks that the pond scum in Washington DC gives two shits about anyone besides themselves, is IMHO naive. 

Here's a good video that tells it like it is ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsL6mKxtOlQ

[Brian37]

Right, hasn't gotten better or worse. I believe you. Thats because when sane voters and sane politicians actually want to do something one party obstructs anything positive that could improve it. Because it is more important to the right wing to please their corporate sponsors.

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It took a little over a year for the ACA to get passed and even then the GOP stuck so much bullshit in it while it is still better than what we have, it could have been far better. But when the banks and car companies crashed took no time at all to bail them out.

[nihilistcat]

Right, hasn't gotten better or worse. I believe you. Thats because when sane voters and sane politicians actually want to do something one party obstructs anything positive that could improve it. Because it is more important to the right wing to please their corporate sponsors.

And what about the DNC corporate sponsors? In fact, when it comes to healthcare and big pharma, the DNC has been their best friends. Do you really think a "public option" was ever truly on the table? That's just as naive as those poor saps in New York who actually believed a shit bag like Cuomo would fight for publicly financed campaigns. 

Snap out of it man 

[Brian37]

No this is not about both parties being the same, get that through your head.

Dems today were no different than Teddy Roosevelt was a republican back then. He was for labor and workers rights, and the Dems back then are our republicans today.

I said before, the only thing I blame Democratic politicians for is being too compromising and our voter apathy.

Only one party is responsible for this and only one the plutocrats are responsible for this. Dems are simply allowing themselves to be blackmailed and pulled along. If they would stop doing that, we could reverse this mess.

[nihilistcat]

Look, I'm not trying to be an ass. At one time I supported dems, but I've seen too much evidence at this point that tells me ... they are full of shit. I mean, years of activism, legal work, politicking, you name it. In fact at this point I think there's a really good argument that goes something like this. Democrats are the worse because they're allowing this takeover of government by corporations, while creating a false pretense that our government and system is still benevolent, which stymies the sort of action necessary to truly change this system in the way it needs to be changed. So if republicans win, all the better, because they'll accelerate our decline and push people into action, and then maybe we'll have a chance.

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No this is not about both parties being the same, get that through your head.

Dems today were no different than Teddy Roosevelt was a republican back then. He was for labor and workers rights, and the Dems back then are our republicans today.

I said before, the only thing I blame Democratic politicians for is being too compromising and our voter apathy.

Only one party is responsible for this and only one the plutocrats are responsible for this. Dems are simply allowing themselves to be blackmailed and pulled along. If they would stop doing that, we could reverse this mess.

Well, keep living the dream, you certainly have the right to believe as you wish.