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Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
#21
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(4th January 2017, 15:30)Minimalist Wrote:
Quote:Yeah. It's funny how, with all those drawbacks with the bible, that christianity has spread all over the world and is the largest religion in the world.

Funny how you left out European colonialism.  Why is that?  Ashamed of the white man's burden, Lek?

I beat you to it, but I guess mine mostly focused on the Western spread, yours encompasses the Eastern spread too.
Raj: They’re going to sell out!
Howard: What are we going to do?
Sheldon: All right, this goes against everything I stand for but desperate times call for desperate measures. Lord, this is Sheldon Cooper. You’re good friends with my mom. I know I’ve spent my life denying that you exist…
Howard: Got ‘em!
Sheldon: And I will continue to do so! - The Big Bang Theory
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#22
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(3rd January 2017, 20:56)Lek Wrote: These are my thoughts on the subject.  First of all, christians don't disagree on everything in the bible, but if you take any manuscript written thousands of years ago in Hebrew or Greek, and then translate into a modern day language, you're going to have much disagreement on the meaning of parts of the writings.  I don't think that the bible was written to be a manual. It was written with the purpose of leading people to Christ.  All christians agree that Jesus Christ is the savior and the only way to God.  There is nothing in the bible that says that all followers of Christ must have the exact same opinion of every passage in the bible.  Maybe we'll all know the meaning when we get to the next life.  Many older christians know more about the bible than newer ones, but they are all equal followers of Jesus.  Why would God choose this way?  Maybe he wants us to search, discuss and debate, which makes it much less boring.
1. With so many modern translations there still is no agreement about the meaning. The bible doesn't even agree with itself, so how could there be?
2. There is scripture that says xtians are supposed to agree
John 17 21 Wrote:That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Then again, maybe I do agree with you since Jesus and his father disagreed on the importance of the Sabbath.
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
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#23
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
You know what's amazing? If we stopped teaching children to talk, all over the world, in a single generation all of humanity will have forgotten all about all concepts of god (at least as established) and will need to learn to do everything all over again from scratch. Why would god build this defect into his creation so that a massive event that would kill off adults (like that one episode of Star Trek) might leave children stranded in this way and make them go feral, if he supposedly has built knowledge of him into our hearts and has a flawless ability to communicate if he chose to? Surely if feral children with no spoken language of any kind could still be made to understand divine language. Any theists want to touch this point?
Raj: They’re going to sell out!
Howard: What are we going to do?
Sheldon: All right, this goes against everything I stand for but desperate times call for desperate measures. Lord, this is Sheldon Cooper. You’re good friends with my mom. I know I’ve spent my life denying that you exist…
Howard: Got ‘em!
Sheldon: And I will continue to do so! - The Big Bang Theory
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#24
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(4th January 2017, 17:05)Astonished Wrote: You know what's amazing? If we stopped teaching children to talk, all over the world, in a single generation all of humanity will have forgotten all about all concepts of god (at least as established) and will need to learn to do everything all over again from scratch. Why would god build this defect into his creation so that a massive event that would kill off adults (like that one episode of Star Trek) might leave children stranded in this way and make them go feral, if he supposedly has built knowledge of him into our hearts and has a flawless ability to communicate if he chose to? Surely if feral children with no spoken language of any kind could still be made to understand divine language. Any theists want to touch this point?
I'm not a theist, but I would like to say something.

If god can communicate flawlessly with some divine language, why did he choose instead to communicate through the flawed translations of an original manuscript that conveniently no longer exists?
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
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#25
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(4th January 2017, 17:36)Rhondazvous Wrote:
(4th January 2017, 17:05)Astonished Wrote: You know what's amazing? If we stopped teaching children to talk, all over the world, in a single generation all of humanity will have forgotten all about all concepts of god (at least as established) and will need to learn to do everything all over again from scratch. Why would god build this defect into his creation so that a massive event that would kill off adults (like that one episode of Star Trek) might leave children stranded in this way and make them go feral, if he supposedly has built knowledge of him into our hearts and has a flawless ability to communicate if he chose to? Surely if feral children with no spoken language of any kind could still be made to understand divine language. Any theists want to touch this point?
I'm not a theist, but I would like to say something.

If god can communicate flawlessly with some divine language, why did he choose instead to communicate through the flawed translations of an original manuscript that conveniently no longer exists?

Because he either didn't give enough of a fuck to make it clear to us, or he's merely the fictional, fevered imagining of very, very flawed and more primitive humans than us.

Any other theories would have to be less credible than these two extremes.
Raj: They’re going to sell out!
Howard: What are we going to do?
Sheldon: All right, this goes against everything I stand for but desperate times call for desperate measures. Lord, this is Sheldon Cooper. You’re good friends with my mom. I know I’ve spent my life denying that you exist…
Howard: Got ‘em!
Sheldon: And I will continue to do so! - The Big Bang Theory
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#26
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(4th January 2017, 18:26)Astonished Wrote:
(4th January 2017, 17:36)Rhondazvous Wrote: I'm not a theist, but I would like to say something.

If god can communicate flawlessly with some divine language, why did he choose instead to communicate through the flawed translations of an original manuscript that conveniently no longer exists?

Because he either didn't give enough of a fuck to make it clear to us, or he's merely the fictional, fevered imagining of very, very flawed and more primitive humans than us.

Any other theories would have to be less credible than these two extremes.
I'd put my money on the second option. Nothing adds up. I could write a more credible and comprehensible story in the 12th grade. Are you familiar with the works of Bart Ehrman? Based on the interest that you've expressed, I think you'll find him a treasure.
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
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#27
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(4th January 2017, 19:57)Rhondazvous Wrote:
(4th January 2017, 18:26)Astonished Wrote: Because he either didn't give enough of a fuck to make it clear to us, or he's merely the fictional, fevered imagining of very, very flawed and more primitive humans than us.

Any other theories would have to be less credible than these two extremes.
I'd put my money on the second option. Nothing adds up.  I could write a more credible and comprehensible story in the 12th grade. Are you familiar with the works of Bart Ehrman? Based on the interest that you've expressed, I think you'll find him a treasure.

I see in the bible a story that begins with the creation of the universe, progresses through the history of the Jewish nation and culminates in the life and death of Jesus, who is the answer to the consequences of the sin which began within the first few chapters. It comes with the fulfillment of hundreds of prophesies made throughout the story. It's real easy to follow the theme from beginning to end. As far as it's purpose to lead the reader to the Messiah and salvation, it does it's job very well. It's true that it takes much time and study to understand every concept. I do understand why you guys don't accept what is written in the bible as truth. The bible in itself isn't enough to endow faith in an individual. That's a direct action between God and the individual.
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#28
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(4th January 2017, 20:54)Lek Wrote:
(4th January 2017, 19:57)Rhondazvous Wrote: I'd put my money on the second option. Nothing adds up.  I could write a more credible and comprehensible story in the 12th grade. Are you familiar with the works of Bart Ehrman? Based on the interest that you've expressed, I think you'll find him a treasure.

I see in the bible a story that begins with the creation of the universe, progresses through the history of the Jewish nation and culminates in the life and death of Jesus, who is the answer to the consequences of the sin which began within the first few chapters.  It comes with the fulfillment of hundreds of prophesies made throughout the story.  It's real easy to follow the theme from beginning to end.  As far as it's purpose to lead the reader to the Messiah and salvation, it does it's job very well.  It's true that it takes much time and study to understand every concept.  I do understand why you guys don't accept what is written in the bible as truth.  The bible in itself isn't enough to endow faith in an individual.  That's a direct action between God and the individual.
There's no universe in the bible. The god of the bible created the grass and trees before he created the sun and moon. Then he hung the sun and moon right here in the Earth's atmosphere (firmament). The biblical writers had not the foggiest notion of a universe.
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
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#29
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(4th January 2017, 21:08)Rhondazvous Wrote: There's no universe in the bible. The god of the bible created the grass and trees before he created the sun and moon.  Then he hung the sun and moon right here in the Earth's atmosphere (firmament). The biblical writers had not the foggiest notion of a universe.

Okay. It was focused on the earth.
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#30
RE: Truth in a story which is entirely dependent upon subjective interpretation
(3rd January 2017, 22:19)Lek Wrote: Yeah.  It's funny how, with all those drawbacks with the bible, that christianity has spread all over the world and is the largest religion in the world.

That same criterion would make syphilis one of the world's top religions.
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(21st June 2016, 07:31)Homeless Nutter Wrote: When someone is knocked on the head, they may see stars. That doesn't mean we should rely on their testimony, when studying astrophysics...
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