Boru

(July 21, 2015 at 7:23 pm)Whateverist the White Wrote:

(July 21, 2015 at 1:54 pm)omnomnom Wrote: I am seriously fed up with some religious people imposing their beliefs on me. But I am even more angry when some liberals (who hypocritically claim to actually "live and let live") impose their beliefs on others as well. This whole controversial gay issue is a prime example. Those Christian dude's who refused to bake a cake for a gay couple get fined for not doing so??? Are you telling us What to believe? Are you infringing our 1rst amendment rights?

Because the main point of the first amendment is your right to refuse service to groups you hate.  I feel you (at arm's length.)

(July 21, 2015 at 1:54 pm)omnomnom Wrote: The very thing you gay liberals were fighting FOR? Who is being the *hypocrite* and *bigot* and *infringing first amendment rights* now? Just because some Christian assholes told you to go to hell doesn't mean you got to beat the shit out of all of us. I don't believe in gay stuff anymore and I have the right to do so let me live and let live. We agree to disagree, you don't attack me, I don't attack you. Your rainbow flags and all of a sudden playing the victim card to attack a group of people that you have a grudge shows your hypocrisy. Of course this doesn't excuse Christians from doing the same thing themselves. Everyone protect each other's first amendment rights.

I've never seen a more blatant case.  This guy is going to be so sore when he realizes what a bottom he really is.  (Cue Vorlon to show him the soaps.)

1)

If he were a Christian, he'd be right up there with Drippy and the gang.

Like the comedian Chris Rock said, anybody you hate will wind up in your family. Son comes home, "Mom, Dad, guess who's coming to dinner?"

(July 22, 2015 at 6:15 am)omnomnom Wrote:

(July 22, 2015 at 6:11 am)abaris Wrote: Immoral based on what exactly? Other than your homophobia that is.

No dude. You an fck whoever you want, I don't care but don't expect me to accommodate your practices and force me to bake a cake. Thats bigotry and moralaphobia. Your just a bigot against someone with different morals than you. Actually understand what first amendment rights are asshole. You know I'm not a homophobe. I even have gay friends but don't force me to bake a cake for their wedding, that's just Marxist assholism.

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(July 21, 2015 at 10:44 pm)Beccs Wrote: I have a premonition.

Soon someone in this thread will be banned as a troll.

Why don't you see my poin I don't give a shit about who you have sex with. I don't care. Be gay and do whatever you want. Buy don't infringe MY RIGHTS and force me to accomadate your beliefs. That is pure assholism. Do you get me?

Oh no he didn't go there. I'm not a racist. some of my best friends are niggers.

"Moralaphobia?"
Somebody get me my smelling salts.

I guess you have a right to own a bakery and refuse service to whom you want. But we're not talking about a bakery owner. We're talking about an employee. An employee is paid to represent his employee, not himself. If he can't do that then he has every right to get a new job.

(July 22, 2015 at 4:08 pm)rexbeccarox Wrote: EW!

Eat it!

Quote:Buy don't infringe MY RIGHTS and force me to accomadate your beliefs. That is pure assholism. Do you get me?

It's you who don't seem to get it.  Try to grasp this:  living in a democratic society is all ABOUT accommodation.  No one's asking you to be gay, or to officiate at a same-sex wedding or anything of the sort.  But what you cannot do is to refuse to trade with people whom - for whatever reason - you happen to dislike.  It doesn't matter what you don't like about them; their politics or their sexual orientation or their skin tone or their favourite football club.

Your rights are in no wise being infringed by law requiring you to treat with same sex couples on an equal footing.  In fact, laws exist to prevent you from refusing to treat with those with whom you disagree.  As far as religion goes, you are free to believe whatever you like - your own loony notions are your business and nobody else's.  What you cannot do is to manifest these beliefs in a way that makes second-class citizens out of people who behave in a way contrary to the customs of your particular tribe.  If you sell a wedding cake to a gay couple, you are NOT supporting or endorsing same-sex marriage.  If you sell a car to a gay couple, you are not endorsing same-sex marriage.  If you send your child to a school where her teacher is in a same sex marriage, you are not endorsing gay marriage.

In all those cases, what you are doing is affirming the right of free people in a free society to live out their lives in the same way you want to be free to live out yours - to be free from being discriminated against. 

If General Washington were alive today, he'd give you a belt round the ear hole.

Boru

If the OP is talking about what I think they're talking about (and, frankly, it's hard to tell with their atrocious spelling and grammar), then the Portland, Oregon bakery was apparently violating a 2007 anti-discrimination law for that state.  Which, if the OP doesn't like it and they live in Oregon, they should vote for state legislators who will tweak/abolish the law.  Welcome to representative democracy.

Now, refusal of service is a tricky issue.  I'm not wise enough, legally speaking, to come up with a magic bullet potential solution.  What I will say is that it seems like theists tend to think that people desiring to engage in an economic transaction of money <--> goods/services with them are actually asking for validation and approval.  Which is just completely fucking idiotic.  Sometimes a cake is just a cake.  Baking it doesn't mean you're "involved" in the wedding.  You're not on the guest list.  Get the fuck over yourselves.

Personally, I think the only times a refusal of service is reasonable is either when the people desiring the service are causing a disturbance from the get-go, or if providing the service will lead to someone being harmed.

Quote:Personally, I think the only times a refusal of service is reasonable is either when the people desiring the service are causing a disturbance from the get-go, or if providing the service will lead to someone being harmed.

Wait...does this mean I have to stop selling heroin and broken glass to toddlers?

STOPP INFRIGNING MY 1STR AMMENDMANT RIGHTS AND ACCOMIDATE MY BELEEFS!!!

Boru

(July 22, 2015 at 6:19 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

Quote:Personally, I think the only times a refusal of service is reasonable is either when the people desiring the service are causing a disturbance from the get-go, or if providing the service will lead to someone being harmed.

Wait...does this mean I have to stop selling heroin and broken glass to toddlers?

STOPP INFRIGNING MY 1STR AMMENDMANT RIGHTS AND ACCOMIDATE MY BELEEFS!!!

Boru

It depends.  Are you going to eat the toddlers shortly after giving them heroin and broken glass?

(July 22, 2015 at 4:44 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote: If he were a Christian, he'd be right up there with Drippy and the gang.

Oh, he is. The whole pretend atheist was a sham. Christian and Repub. The usual poisonous cocktail.

(July 22, 2015 at 6:03 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: But what you cannot do is to refuse to trade with people whom - for whatever reason - you happen to dislike. 

Really? Forcing people to provide products or services against their will is slavery. Infringing on a person's freedom of association without a compelling state interest is fascism.

But apparently you believe it is enough of a compelling state interest to make someone bake you a cake against their will. Tell me honestly, do you seriously believe it is right to take away a families livelihood and fine them over $100,000 because they will not bake you a cake for whatever reason? Seems like a wildly out of control overreaction over what? Oooo someone hurt feelings. Stop whining. Pick up your toys and have your pretend wedding somewhere else.