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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 1:48 pm
(This post was last modified: December 25, 2015 at 1:49 pm by ErGingerbreadMandude.)
(December 25, 2015 at 1:44 pm)robvalue Wrote: I would say my position is the atheistic one. I have no beliefs about the origin of the universe, if there was one. Positing a particular origin, design, I would say is more akin to theism.
Why do you think it is more akin to theism?
I think we can all agree that Atheism is literally a rebellious attitude as that to question a traditional approach. And Theism is more like following a traditional approach without question.
Don't you think this whole concept of design is a new take on an outlook challenging the traditional approach? (I think I'm probably the only guy that thinks this design and shit is real.)
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 2:15 pm
(December 25, 2015 at 6:56 am)pool Wrote: [edit]
The world we live in supports my conclusion if we consider any system with rules imposed on it as designed. Since everyone seems to agree with that, I think my conclusion is supported, after all this is not just a random thought, I came across this thought as I was analyzing certain facts, definitions and generally through basic observation.
We live in a designed world. It's a fact. Was it intelligent design or was it a design that came into being as a result of random events or whatever is what I know that I do not know.
I don't get this at all. You will need to expand on this some more.
How are rules imposed? I think the rules, we as rational beings, put in place for a description, an explanation, of an effect/action/observation.
Please give me an example where the rules were designed first and then something in the world was made to fit or behave within those rules.
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 2:17 pm
Because you're making a claim, and I'm not making any claim 
I can't understand what you mean at all I'm afraid. I couldn't last time, so I doubt I will this time. It appears to be the classic fallacy of composition, but I don't even understand your usage of the word "designed".
It's interesting though, nonetheless
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 3:00 pm
(This post was last modified: December 25, 2015 at 3:02 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(December 25, 2015 at 1:39 pm)pool Wrote: (December 25, 2015 at 12:25 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Let's make sure it's not a simple misunderstanding in the use of terms. Are evolved creatures designed creatures, to you, Pool? Does evolutionary biology seem, to you, to design things?
If you have any doubt about what I mean when I said design refer to the previous posts.
None of your posts can answer that question for me, or I wouldn't have asked. Is evolution, for example, an imposed rule? As in, the earth is a system with imposed rules of evolutionary biology?
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 4:58 pm
(December 25, 2015 at 1:48 pm)pool Wrote: (December 25, 2015 at 1:44 pm)robvalue Wrote: I would say my position is the atheistic one. I have no beliefs about the origin of the universe, if there was one. Positing a particular origin, design, I would say is more akin to theism.
Why do you think it is more akin to theism?
I think we can all agree that Atheism is literally a rebellious attitude as that to question a traditional approach. And Theism is more like following a traditional approach without question.
Don't you think this whole concept of design is a new take on an outlook challenging the traditional approach? (I think I'm probably the only guy that thinks this design and shit is real.)
Atheism is not rebellious attitude, it is a response to the claim that god's exist. It is a matter of not being convinced about the truth of a claim, no attitude is required. Just as if someone told me they had a pet dragon and I said "I don't believe you", that's not a rebellious attitude towards dragons.
Your not the only guy that thinks design is real, that I can assure you, theists have been peddling the design argument for a long time and they have been trying to weasel it into science classes.
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 8:23 pm
(This post was last modified: December 25, 2015 at 8:27 pm by Alex K.)
(December 24, 2015 at 8:32 am)Quantum Wrote: (December 23, 2015 at 5:32 pm)Veritas Wrote: What's the best way to refute the argument that we were intelligently designed? I've seen the bit that Neil Degrasse Tyson did on it, but what else can I put into my arsenal? (More specifically, about how complex flowers are and other things in nature)
What argument?
So, have we seen an argument to refute yet?
And no, "what about molecules???" is not an argument.
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 8:27 pm
Prove god first. Lets not put the cart before the horse.
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 11:45 pm
(December 25, 2015 at 3:00 pm)Rhythm Wrote: (December 25, 2015 at 1:39 pm)pool Wrote: If you have any doubt about what I mean when I said design refer to the previous posts.
None of your posts can answer that question for me, or I wouldn't have asked. Is evolution, for example, an imposed rule? As in, the earth is a system with imposed rules of evolutionary biology?
I don't understand that question - "Is earth a system with imposed rules of evolutionary biology". Probably because of my lack of knowledge in the subject.
I can give you another example to understand what i mean by design though, an example of imposed rules on the system that is earth would be the laws of physics. Get it?
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 25, 2015 at 11:50 pm
(This post was last modified: December 25, 2015 at 11:52 pm by ErGingerbreadMandude.)
(December 25, 2015 at 8:27 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: Prove god first. Lets not put the cart before the horse.
God and intelligent design has something in common. I'm not saying that I believe if the design that is present was performed by intelligent beings, just that there is a design - which has nothing to do with God.
People seem to think that if they admit there is a design then they will be tricked into also agreeing with intelligent design - No they won't. Why?
Because a design doesn't necessarily imply intelligent design as a design can be achieved by random events too.
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RE: Intelligent Design
December 26, 2015 at 12:00 am
Can I ask if you are thinking that the laws of physics are proscriptive, as in "thou shalt conserve energy, on penalty of punishment" or similar?
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