I never get a good response from anyone of any label. I really want to see anyone, answer the following without quoting their club or book or holy person. This I am inviting anyone any Muslim or Christian or Buddhist or Hindu, anyone. 

Consider the following and THINK hard before you respond.

The question is not "Why" 

But

"Why do you feel the need to buy your position over any other" And I don't want to hear "My club" I want your answer coming from you, don't regurgitate what your club/writings say.

Every follower of every religion, be it Christianity or Islam or Jewish or Buddhist or Hindu and all the sects of the world's religions, everyone who follows a holy writing or holy person or buys into a sect, has a reason "why". That means nothing.

The real challenge is self introspection which most don't want to face. The real question the follower of any religion should ask themselves isn't "why" but "Why do I feel the need to buy this?" 

If you are simply making an apology, you are not being objective, you are looking for a reason, that is not objective, that is simply looking for an excuse. 

If you ask yourself "Why do I feel the need to buy this" is a much harder question to ask yourself. 

Does the follower think if they leave their position for another club that they will suddenly burst in flames? If not then why do you feel the need to buy your position? If you can see others who hold other positions as also being good and doing good, then again, why do you feel the need to hold your position and not the position of others? I am not aiming that challenge at only Christians, but all followers of all religions, Muslims and Jews and Hindus and Buddhists ect ect ect....

Maybe humans need to consider those ideas are merely things they find comfort in. Maybe it is simply something you like and allowed your emotions to draw you in?

I "buy into" my position because it makes the most sense to me

I think it is a bit of a loaded question though. It's not about "feeling the need to buy it." I believe in it bc I do genuinely think it's true.

(April 23, 2017 at 9:23 am)Brian37 Wrote: I never get a good response from anyone of any label. I really want to see anyone, answer the following without quoting their club or book or holy person. This I am inviting anyone any Muslim or Christian or Buddhist or Hindu, anyone. 

Consider the following and THINK hard before you respond.

The question is not "Why" 

But

"Why do you feel the need to buy your position over any other" And I don't want to hear "My club" I want your answer coming from you, don't regurgitate what your club/writings say.

Every follower of every religion, be it Christianity or Islam or Jewish or Buddhist or Hindu and all the sects of the world's religions, everyone who follows a holy writing or holy person or buys into a sect, has a reason "why". That means nothing.

The real challenge is self introspection which most don't want to face. The real question the follower of any religion should ask themselves isn't "why" but "Why do I feel the need to buy this?" 

If you are simply making an apology, you are not being objective, you are looking for a reason, that is not objective, that is simply looking for an excuse. 

If you ask yourself "Why do I feel the need to buy this" is a much harder question to ask yourself. 

Does the follower think if they leave their position for another club that they will suddenly burst in flames? If not then why do you feel the need to buy your position? If you can see others who hold other positions as also being good and doing good, then again, why do you feel the need to hold your position and not the position of others? I am not aiming that challenge at only Christians, but all followers of all religions, Muslims and Jews and Hindus and Buddhists ect ect ect....

Maybe humans need to consider those ideas are merely things they find comfort in. Maybe it is simply something you like and allowed your emotions to draw you in?

It is all about filling the gap that lead you to a sense of completeness.
It is an innate feeling that leave you no escape.
You can ignore, postpone or shelve for sometime but sooner or later that feeling will come back to you again and again until you deal with.  

(April 23, 2017 at 10:34 am)Aoi Magi Wrote: I "buy into" my position because it makes the most sense to me

So? Still not addressing anything.

Allah makes sense to Muslims
Yahweh makes sense to Jews
Jesus makes sense to Christians
Buddha makes sense to Buddhists
Bhrama makes sense to Hindus.

 It isn't that simple. I get your position makes sense TO YOU, but how does that make it anything more than you like it? Your position doesn't make sense to others otherwise they would hold the same position you do. 

"It makes sense to me" is not objective, everyone claims that.

Again, WHY do you feel the need to hold your position? It is a fair question and one again, this thread is aimed at anyone who has a religion of any religion.

---

(April 23, 2017 at 10:46 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I think it is a bit of a loaded question though. It's not about "feeling the need to buy it." I believe in it bc I do genuinely think it's true.

Not a loaded question. 

I am not doubting that you truly believe it. So what, other humans follow other religions and truly believe what they believe. 

If have no neutral way to demonstrate the credibility of what you "truly believe" then it still boils down to what you like believing. I think you fail to consider that. 

Huge difference between "I truly believe" which only says you believe.

And the same problem followers of any religion have.

Nobody of any religion has a neutral way of demonstrating the credibility of the positions they hold.

So again, to you the Christian, and to any Muslim or Jew or Hindu or Buddhist ect ect..... 

Not "Why"....

But

"Why do you feel the need to hold your position"...... The only honest answer can be you really want to believe it and really like the idea.

---

(April 23, 2017 at 11:04 am)Little Rik Wrote:

(April 23, 2017 at 9:23 am)Brian37 Wrote: I never get a good response from anyone of any label. I really want to see anyone, answer the following without quoting their club or book or holy person. This I am inviting anyone any Muslim or Christian or Buddhist or Hindu, anyone. 

Consider the following and THINK hard before you respond.

The question is not "Why" 

But

"Why do you feel the need to buy your position over any other" And I don't want to hear "My club" I want your answer coming from you, don't regurgitate what your club/writings say.

Every follower of every religion, be it Christianity or Islam or Jewish or Buddhist or Hindu and all the sects of the world's religions, everyone who follows a holy writing or holy person or buys into a sect, has a reason "why". That means nothing.

The real challenge is self introspection which most don't want to face. The real question the follower of any religion should ask themselves isn't "why" but "Why do I feel the need to buy this?" 

If you are simply making an apology, you are not being objective, you are looking for a reason, that is not objective, that is simply looking for an excuse. 

If you ask yourself "Why do I feel the need to buy this" is a much harder question to ask yourself. 

Does the follower think if they leave their position for another club that they will suddenly burst in flames? If not then why do you feel the need to buy your position? If you can see others who hold other positions as also being good and doing good, then again, why do you feel the need to hold your position and not the position of others? I am not aiming that challenge at only Christians, but all followers of all religions, Muslims and Jews and Hindus and Buddhists ect ect ect....

Maybe humans need to consider those ideas are merely things they find comfort in. Maybe it is simply something you like and allowed your emotions to draw you in?

It is all about filling the gap that lead you to a sense of completeness.
It is an innate feeling that leave you no escape.
You can ignore, postpone or shelve for sometime but sooner or later that feeling will come back to you again and again until you deal with.  

"Its all about filling the gap"

And that is our species problem right there. 

The ancient Egyptians for 3,000 years filled in the gap with the sun god Ra and Osiris and Horis and Isis, and while that gap filling did create social order, it turned out none of those gods were ever real.

Yes it can lead you to a sense of completeness, but so what, what good is a made up answer just because you like it? I think our species has made far more progress by questioning our social norms.

(April 23, 2017 at 11:12 am)Brian37 Wrote:  It isn't that simple. I get your position makes sense TO YOU, but how does that make it anything more than you like it? Your position doesn't make sense to others otherwise they would hold the same position you do. 

"It makes sense to me" is not objective, everyone claims that.

Again, WHY do you feel the need to hold your position? It is a fair question and one again, this thread is aimed at anyone who has a religion of any religion.

Why would my beliefs be based on "need" or need to be objective? Beliefs are subjective, and the reason I gave is for mine alone.

Brian, what answer are you looking for? You asked the question, got answers, and rejected them for no other reason - as far as I can tell - than they weren't the answers you wanted. From what I read, each of the answers given (even Rik's, if you're willing to stretch a point or two) would be valid answers to the question, 'Why do you feel the need to buy atheism?'

Maybe you could save time in threads like this by doing something like, 'Here is question A. The correct answer is B. If you have any other answer in mind, please don't respond to this thread.'

Boru

(April 23, 2017 at 11:26 am)Aoi Magi Wrote:

(April 23, 2017 at 11:12 am)Brian37 Wrote:  It isn't that simple. I get your position makes sense TO YOU, but how does that make it anything more than you like it? Your position doesn't make sense to others otherwise they would hold the same position you do. 

"It makes sense to me" is not objective, everyone claims that.

Again, WHY do you feel the need to hold your position? It is a fair question and one again, this thread is aimed at anyone who has a religion of any religion.

Why would my beliefs be based on "need" or need to be objective? Beliefs are subjective, and the reason I gave is for mine alone.

I agree beliefs are subjective, which makes my questions far more important. Yes and again your reasons are your reasons alone, I agree with that too.

We are all entitled to believe what we want, that is not the purpose of this thread. This isn't a human rights issue, or a legal issue. It is a challenge to the reader to think and simply not hide behind answers like the one you just gave, one I observe from followers of every religion.

"I have my reasons" yes, and again, so what. Are they credible reasons that can be independently tested or falsified outside your own personal bias your own subjective point of view? We are all entitled to our own beliefs, but nobody is entitled to their own set of facts.

Creationists have their reasons for denying evolution. But evolution is fact regardless of what individual reason they reject that fact. They feel the need to cling to old bad claims because the thought of being wrong frightens them. 

Repeated neutral peer reviewed experimentation is the best filter humans have that acts as a filter to "personal reasons". You can have your reasons sure, but do you really have good reasons outside liking your subjective position, and you , not me said that beliefs are subjective, and I agree.

So when you have competing claims, what determines who got it right?

The need is out of purpose called "Love".

True loved searches for truly what out to be loved and sees what ought to be loved with the highest form of love.

The name of God is that connection of fabrics of love through the channels of his love.

I would elaborate, but you guys been witnessing when I became Deist to when I became inclined to be Muslim to when became Deist again, then Atheist, then Deist, then Muslim.

You are not interested in knowing why I believe, you are simply interested in dismissing my reasons and mocking it.

(April 23, 2017 at 11:12 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(April 23, 2017 at 11:04 am)Little Rik Wrote: It is all about filling the gap that lead you to a sense of completeness.
It is an innate feeling that leave you no escape.
You can ignore, postpone or shelve for sometime but sooner or later that feeling will come back to you again and again until you deal with.  

"Its all about filling the gap"

And that is our species problem right there. 

The ancient Egyptians for 3,000 years filled in the gap with the sun god Ra and Osiris and Horis and Isis, and while that gap filling did create social order, it turned out none of those gods were ever real.

Invent the problem, sell the cure. At least snake oil salesmen actually have snake oil to sell.