Could be that millennial's tend to feel more entitled to things? One could also argue my generation did not see the horrors of what socialism has done to people. I don't consider myself a fan of socialism nor capitalism. Socialism to me means more government, bigger government. I do not like the idea of the government being so involved in my life. And I do not think that is paranoia I just prefer to stand by my Libertarian values. In my opinion the government should serve the basic needs of the people. Protection, security and safety.

I prefer the idea of ownership and personal fiscal responsibility. It should NOT be the governments responsibility to cut you a check for whatever it is such as college, healthcare and welfare. Call me cruel but I think welfare needs to be cut or at least more regulated. It should be used more as temporary form of assistance because it is well abused. I do understand things such as EMS, police and the fire department are forms of socialism. But again, those fall under basic needs the government should provide. Other than that, I do not think the government should be much larger than that. But that is just me as a Libertarian.

I have always been taught to work for everything and pay for something when you know you have the money. Not when you think you will have the money. Take my college for instance, I was lucky enough I began saving when I was a small child. Then, that money was put into stocks and it grew. And now I am graduating college debt free. I consider myself rather lucky. But if I did not have the money for college, I would not dare take out a loan. I'd start at a local community college (which I actually did) and see where that takes me. Community College in my county at least, is very affordable. I think if people learned to stop taking loans out for petty things such as that brand new iphone, that new car etc people would have much more money to spend.

I am also against taxing corporations heavily. Sure, should they be taxed? Absolutely! But just like everyone else. Corporations create jobs and are the reason the majority of us in the private sector do have jobs in the first place.

I think socialism can work in these smaller nations, but we have yet to see is successful in a nation with a large population.

These are just my opinions though. Does not mean I am right, but just how I feel when it comes to the topic on socialism.

(May 24, 2018 at 12:19 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote:

(May 24, 2018 at 11:36 am)Mathilda Wrote: As a non-American I have to say that it's surprising how dirty the word seems to most Americans. Maybe because most Americans have no clue what it's like to live in socialist country. I bet when they think of a socialist country they never think of somewhere like Germany.

You've really stretched the meaning of socialist if you are going to call Germany a socialist country.

Well I lived in Germany for three years and normally live in Britain which is far more right wing. And both countries are socialist compared to America. When living there I was taxed at 50% but when I was unemployed I was given 2/3rd of my previous wage every month for 6 months with no pressure to find work. The government was bringing in free nursery school places for every child in Germany. They have a long history of reps from worker's unions joining the boards of directors in most companies. There were over 30 days annual leave a year as standard, not including the plethora of public holidays. Health care was insurance based but subsidised so I got the same standard of decent quality care regardless of whether I was earning a lot or unemployed. The state also owns much of its own infrastructure, like railways etc.

And what's more, the standard of living was relatively high for everyone.

That's just off the top of my head.

(May 27, 2018 at 7:10 am)Libertarian God Wrote: Could be that millennial's tend to feel more entitled to things?

You're confusing socialism with capitalism.

Socialism is about everyone getting what they need... Capitalism is about "If you work hard you can get whatever you want... oh and by the way it's also largely down to where you are born, who you know, who you rip off and backstab and sheer luck in general."

Pretty sure Trump feels entitled. Pretty sure he's not a fan of socialism.

(May 27, 2018 at 7:10 am)Libertarian God Wrote: Could be that millennial's tend to feel more entitled to things? One could also argue my generation did not see the horrors of what socialism has done to people. I don't consider myself a fan of socialism nor capitalism. Socialism to me means more government, bigger government. I do not like the idea of the government being so involved in my life. And I do not think that is paranoia I just prefer to stand by my Libertarian values. In my opinion the government should serve the basic needs of the people. Protection, security and safety.

I prefer the idea of ownership and personal fiscal responsibility. It should NOT be the governments responsibility to cut you a check for whatever it is such as college, healthcare and welfare. Call me cruel but I think welfare needs to be cut or at least more regulated. It should be used more as temporary form of assistance because it is well abused. I do understand things such as EMS, police and the fire department are forms of socialism. But again, those fall under basic needs the government should provide. Other than that, I do not think the government should be much larger than that. But that is just me as a Libertarian.

I have always been taught to work for everything and pay for something when you know you have the money. Not when you think you will have the money. Take my college for instance, I was lucky enough I began saving when I was a small child. Then, that money was put into stocks and it grew. And now I am graduating college debt free. I consider myself rather lucky. But if I did not have the money for college, I would not dare take out a loan. I'd start at a local community college (which I actually did) and see where that takes me. Community College in my county at least, is very affordable. I think if people learned to stop taking loans out for petty things such as that brand new iphone, that new car etc people would have much more money to spend.

I am also against taxing corporations heavily. Sure, should they be taxed? Absolutely! But just like everyone else. Corporations create jobs and are the reason the majority of us in the private sector do have jobs in the first place.

I think socialism can work in these smaller nations, but we have yet to see is successful in a nation with a large population.

These are just my opinions though. Does not mean I am right, but just how I feel when it comes to the topic on socialism.

When you are talking about the horrors of Socialism, I think what you mean is Communism. These aren't the same thing.

Corporations used to pay 33% of the tax burden. now they pay %9.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/...ations-ha/

They can pay more.

In fact, when the economy is bad and they make less profits, they often don't pay any federal taxes. Do you think a teacher or a factory worker is going to get the same treatment?

When you talk about no larger high population nations being successful with socialism, I think you are purposely setting a standard that can't be met. There aren't many countries that are the same size/population of the US period.

Also as far as I can tell there are no "Socialist" countries anyway. They're all a mix. Socialists all believe in some degree of Capitalism, as far as I know.

I think another possibility is perhaps that Karl Marx's communism was never actually tried out in practice: Tyrants and laypeople got hold of an oversimplified and cartoonized version of it. As far as I'm aware Karl Marx's version has never actually been tried. Maybe it's not realistic, but if compromising what he suggested for something more 'realistic' leads to unworkable and immoral crap Marx himself would never agree with... then it's not really fair to say it's been tried.

(May 27, 2018 at 7:56 am)Edwardo Piet Wrote: I think another possibility is perhaps that Karl Marx's communism was never actually tried out in practice: Tyrants and laypeople got hold of an oversimplified and cartoonized version of it. As far as I'm aware Karl Marx's version has never actually been tried. Maybe it's not realistic, but if compromising what he suggested for something more 'realistic' leads to unworkable and immoral crap Marx himself would never agree with... then it's not really fair to say it's been tried.

I read a book called "A History of Europe" that said that the Soviet Union's Communism turned into a sort of State Capitalism. It's just I don't know what else to call it but Communism.

Wall Street gets tax cuts and subsidies, despite just recently crashing the economy, and people want to talk about millennials feeling entitled? I'll take more socialism, rather than the oligarchy we have now. Our economy needs help, but the government wants to take money from the poor and what's left of the middle class, instead of taking from the people that have the most money. When you need beef, you slaughter the fattest cow, right?

I've thought for a while, we have a standard of living bubble. That our expectations for stuff everybody should have has become a bit unrealistic. One thing from growing up in the 80's is there just wasn't as much stuff to own. We had a small tv, a plug in phone, 3 channels, and a VCR. Now, many people have a tablet, smart phone per person, a data plan, dvr, dvd player, 250 channels, Netflix, Amazon account, large flat screen tv, 2 computers, and high speed internet, and a video game system.

My parents didn't have a dishwasher. Some didn't have Dryers. Some didn't have microwaves. The big yearly vacation was to the lake. The car was a station wagon they'd had forever. Eating at a restaurant was both rare, and we when we did it, we went to pizza hut.

If you were willing to live like people back in the late 70's to early 80's, I bet things would be much more affordable. We sort of get a glimpse of that with Captain Awesome and how he's living.

And the socialism, and leftism in general is just common sense. Millenials don't have a bunch of money, but they want a bunch of stuff. But then some of them get some stuff, and have some kids, and they want to keep their stuff, and give their kids advantages, so they become republicans or libertarians.

If capitalism doesn't die in this century it will be a miracle.

(May 27, 2018 at 8:30 am)henryp Wrote: I've thought for a while, we have a standard of living bubble.  That our expectations for stuff everybody should have has become a bit unrealistic.  One thing from growing up in the 80's is there just wasn't as much stuff to own.  We had a small tv, a plug in phone, 3 channels, and a VCR.   Now, many people have a tablet, smart phone per person, a data plan, dvr, dvd player, 250 channels, Netflix, Amazon account, large flat screen tv, 2 computers, and high speed internet, and a video game system.

My parents didn't have a dishwasher.  Some didn't have Dryers.  Some didn't have microwaves.  The big yearly vacation was to the lake.  The car was a station wagon they'd had forever.  Eating at a restaurant was both rare, and we when we did it, we went to pizza hut.

If you were willing to live like people back in the late 70's to early 80's, I bet things would be much more affordable.  We sort of get a glimpse of that with Captain Awesome and how he's living.

And the socialism, and leftism in general is just common sense.  Millenials don't have a bunch of money, but they want a bunch of stuff.  But then some of them get some stuff, and have some kids, and they want to keep their stuff, and give their kids advantages, so they become republicans or libertarians.

Real wages haven't gone up in decades. Productivity has gone up by huge amounts.