Alot of religious people don't consider themselves religious because they don't believe in gods, even if they believe in the moral import of a whole host of other equally superstitious things. Even when those particular superstitious beliefs unite everyone who accepts them into some moral community.

Hell, alot of people who believe in gods don't consider themselves religious, too, and probably have a better claim to it if they're not entirely convinced of their own (or any) moral postulates hinging on the divine.

If god botherers stopped shitting in the religious bowl it wouldn't be such a dirty word.

(November 24, 2021 at 11:39 pm)Ferrocyanide Wrote:

(November 24, 2021 at 5:43 pm)Brian37 Wrote: If you accept that religion won't go away, and I agree, then why are you "astonished"? 

I'd only use the word "astonished" in the context that people cling to the past so much. But I've always accepted to greater or lesser degrees, humans are tribal and superstitious.

I agree. There is no reason to be surprised, once you know humans well enough.
It is a big planet with billions of all sorts of people living in all sorts of conditions.
Some are curious, some are less curious, some want an education for education sake, some just want a diploma and a nice paycheck.

Not every human is going to be a genius.

If some of them are comfortable with a certain religion, then let them enjoy their religion.
I think everyone has a certain natural state. Some are attracted to helping others cross the street, some don’t want to work and prefer to steal purses, some will kill you for 100$ and less, etc.

I remember a part from a Richard Dawkins video. I think he was in the UK. There was a certain teacher and he said something like this:
Without religion, I don’t know how to teach these boys morals, how to teach them that stealing is wrong.
There was a boy who told me, before taking this class, it had never occurred to me that stealing was wrong.

Then the camera shifts to Richard Dawkins alone, facing the camera and I think he said:
I did not know what to tell that guy. Certainly, religion can be used to control the behavior of those boys.


^^^^^I think that Richard Dawkins or me can give them reasons why building a society that works together is better than a society of thieves.
You can also invite some 70 y old from prison who has been there most of his life for a murder. Maybe that will start a spark in their mind.

It’s just that it is too time consuming. Maybe christianity is a nice shortcut:
Tell them to behave or they are going to hell, since the big cop in the sky is watching.

It isn't a matter of "enjoying" a religion. There is always a difference between freedom of thought, and tribalism. Hitler convinced his followers to worship his absolute power, and that cost the world over 50 million lives.

It will never cease to exist because disbelief in God was defeated once and for all. Science itself proved by evidence that the universe has a "starting point", and the event that created everything is called the "Big Bang".

Here's the picture describing our universe's creation:



Who caused the "Big Bang"? or is it legal to ask such a question scientifically? Meanings themselves have no meaning before that point.
But how is the "Big Bang" intelligent enough to make us humans come to being? doesn't that mean the the religious idea of "fate/meant to be" is not so outlandish and weird?

Here, the idea of "Intelligent design" pops up: this explosion "Big Bang" was an intelligent explosion with precise meant to be calculations that resulted in human creation!

Religion will never cease to exist, because science did prove that the Big Bang theory is real enough.

Getting that behind us, it comes to choosing "which God to believe was behind this Big Bang".
Personally, I believe it is Allah who revealed the Quran.

(December 22, 2021 at 5:44 am)WinterHold Wrote: It will never cease to exist because disbelief in God was defeated once and for all. Science itself proved by evidence that the universe has a "starting point", and the event that created everything is called the "Big Bang".

Here's the picture describing our universe's creation:



Who caused the "Big Bang"? or is it legal to ask such a question scientifically? Meanings themselves have no meaning before that point.
But how is the "Big Bang" intelligent enough to make us humans come to being? doesn't that mean the the religious idea of "fate/meant to be" is not so outlandish and weird?

Here, the idea of "Intelligent design" pops up: this explosion "Big Bang" was an intelligent explosion with precise meant to be calculations that resulted in human creation!

Religion will never cease to exist, because science did prove that the Big Bang theory is real enough.

Getting that behind us, it comes to choosing "which God to believe was behind this Big Bang".
Personally, I believe it is Allah who revealed the Quran.

If the Big Bang was deliberately made with human life as its intended purpose, why is virtually all of the universe inimical to human life? Seems kinda wasteful.

Boru

(December 22, 2021 at 5:44 am)WinterHold Wrote: It will never cease to exist because disbelief in God was defeated once and for all. Science itself proved by evidence that the universe has a "starting point", and the event that created everything is called the "Big Bang".

Here's the picture describing our universe's creation:



Who caused the "Big Bang"? or is it legal to ask such a question scientifically? Meanings themselves have no meaning before that point.
But how is the "Big Bang" intelligent enough to make us humans come to being? doesn't that mean the the religious idea of "fate/meant to be" is not so outlandish and weird?

Here, the idea of "Intelligent design" pops up: this explosion "Big Bang" was an intelligent explosion with precise meant to be calculations that resulted in human creation!

Religion will never cease to exist, because science did prove that the Big Bang theory is real enough.

Getting that behind us, it comes to choosing "which God to believe was behind this Big Bang".
Personally, I believe it is Allah who revealed the Quran.

Strange combination for conformation and cognitive bias. Maybe I should just all it wishful thinking to make it easier for you.

(December 22, 2021 at 5:44 am)WinterHold Wrote: It will never cease to exist because disbelief in God was defeated once and for all. Science itself proved by evidence that the universe has a "starting point", and the event that created everything is called the "Big Bang".

Here's the picture describing our universe's creation:



Who caused the "Big Bang"? or is it legal to ask such a question scientifically? Meanings themselves have no meaning before that point.
But how is the "Big Bang" intelligent enough to make us humans come to being? doesn't that mean the the religious idea of "fate/meant to be" is not so outlandish and weird?

Here, the idea of "Intelligent design" pops up: this explosion "Big Bang" was an intelligent explosion with precise meant to be calculations that resulted in human creation!

Religion will never cease to exist, because science did prove that the Big Bang theory is real enough.

Getting that behind us, it comes to choosing "which God to believe was behind this Big Bang".
Personally, I believe it is Allah who revealed the Quran.

You are possessed of some common misunderstandings about the big bang. It does not stipulate that the universe had a beginning. Since that is wrong, everything else is also wrong.

After nearly nine years here, how many converts has @WinterHold brought over to his faith?

None, even if you include winter. Guys still trying to convince himself.

Fake it till you make it, I suppose.

(December 22, 2021 at 5:44 am)WinterHold Wrote: It will never cease to exist because disbelief in God was defeated once and for all. Science itself proved by evidence that the universe has a "starting point", and the event that created everything is called the "Big Bang".

Here's the picture describing our universe's creation:



Who caused the "Big Bang"? or is it legal to ask such a question scientifically? Meanings themselves have no meaning before that point.
But how is the "Big Bang" intelligent enough to make us humans come to being? doesn't that mean the the religious idea of "fate/meant to be" is not so outlandish and weird?

Here, the idea of "Intelligent design" pops up: this explosion "Big Bang" was an intelligent explosion with precise meant to be calculations that resulted in human creation!

Religion will never cease to exist, because science did prove that the Big Bang theory is real enough.

Getting that behind us, it comes to choosing "which God to believe was behind this Big Bang".
Personally, I believe it is Allah who revealed the Quran.

Not even close buddy.