(March 26, 2013 at 3:59 pm)catfish Wrote: Ignorance is quoting a website as an authority that directly supports my position in this so-called "debate"...

Ignorance is assuming there is something wrong with homosexuality or that homosexuals cannot be born that way due to one's outdated religious beliefs.

There are plenty of articles that overwhelmingly support the fact that homosexuality is not a choice. New data is being discovered daily in regards to the genetic debate, whether it arises in the womb or in how our genes are expressed. To state it is a choice, when there is no scientific evidence to back up such a ridiculous claim, is blindly refuting the evidence due to one's prejudices because that individual does not like the evidence readily available.

Note that they do not say anything about psychological causes, and being the APA, you would think they would know if there were such causes.

And I think it's pretty clear that homosexuality is caused by both environmental and genetic (and epigenetic) factors. What's not clear is what environmental factors come into play. It's certainly nothing Freudian, like a missing father.

(March 26, 2013 at 4:07 pm)Mr Infidel Wrote:

(March 26, 2013 at 3:59 pm)catfish Wrote: Ignorance is quoting a website as an authority that directly supports my position in this so-called "debate"...

Ignorance is assuming there is something wrong with homosexuality or that homosexuals cannot be born that way due to one's outdated religious beliefs.

There are plenty of articles that overwhelmingly support the fact that homosexuality is not a choice. New data is being discovered daily in regards to the genetic debate, whether it arises in the womb or in how our genes are expressed. To state it is a choice, when there is no scientific evidence to back up such a ridiculous claim, is blindly refuting the evidence due to one's prejudices because that individual does not like the evidence readily available.

Pay close attention to what I write and not what your anti-religious bias wants to see.

(March 26, 2013 at 4:08 pm)futilethewinds Wrote: What's not clear is what environmental factors come into play. It's certainly nothing Freudian, like a missing father.

As far as I know, there were no environmental factors that influenced my sexual orientation. I was raised by my father, and I was veritably clueless in regards to homosexuality until I reached puberty, discovered I was sexually attracted to guys, and did my research to figure out why I was different.

I think the question (if it hasn't been established yet) is not why catfish thinks it's icky, but whether he thinks it should be illegal for other people to enjoy it.

(March 26, 2013 at 4:11 pm)Mr Infidel Wrote:

(March 26, 2013 at 4:08 pm)futilethewinds Wrote: What's not clear is what environmental factors come into play. It's certainly nothing Freudian, like a missing father.

As far as I know, there were no environmental factors that influenced my sexual orientation. I was raised by my father, and I was veritably clueless in regards to homosexuality until I reached puberty, discovered I was sexually attracted to guys, and did my research to figure out why I was different.

Well, that's the thing, it could be anything. It could be exposure to some sort of chemical in your environment. Science simply does not know what causes gay genes to become "activated," but they are present in some people who do not identify as queer. I don't know of any environmental factors that triggered my homosexuality either, but that doesn't mean there weren't any. I could just be ignorant of them.

(March 26, 2013 at 4:08 pm)futilethewinds Wrote: Note that they do not say anything about psychological causes, and being the APA, you would think they would know if there were such causes.

And I think it's pretty clear that homosexuality is caused by both environmental and genetic (and epigenetic) factors. What's not clear is what environmental factors come into play. It's certainly nothing Freudian, like a missing father.

The APA is a bit dubious since they re-wrote their "dictionary" back in the 70's. Up to that point, they classified homosexuality as a disorder and after that, have a clearly visible "anti-descrimination" agenda to the point of outright lies against their opposition.
And if you don't see the corelation between the FDA's loosened drug restrictions and the APA's "new" disorders and their corresponding medications, there's not much else I can say to you about that (APA).
But seriously, fuck the APA sideways with a sawblade.

And yeah, it very well could be just about a missing father. The problem is the openess to discuss things like this without being branded as a homophobic...

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(March 26, 2013 at 4:14 pm)thesummerqueen Wrote: I think the question (if it hasn't been established yet) is not why catfish thinks it's icky, but whether he thinks it should be illegal for other people to enjoy it.

And finally, someone asks the most pertinent question without assuming my position based solely on my choice of religion... Bravo!

I don't care who fucks who as long as you're not lying to me or my family.

Fuck the APA!!!

"Fuck the APA" - science rewrites itself as it corrects itself. What made them put homosexuality as a disorder to begin with? Quit making conspiratorial correlations.

(March 26, 2013 at 4:11 pm)Mr Infidel Wrote: As far as I know, there were no environmental factors that influenced my sexual orientation. I was raised by my father, and I was veritably clueless in regards to homosexuality until I reached puberty, discovered I was sexually attracted to guys, and did my research to figure out why I was different.

And this is more evidence that you "became" gay and weren't born that way.

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(March 26, 2013 at 4:23 pm)thesummerqueen Wrote: "Fuck the APA" - science rewrites itself as it corrects itself. What made them put homosexuality as a disorder to begin with? Quit making conspiratorial correlations.

Nope, I'll keep making the correlations all I want. When they stop prescribing medications for "diseases" with zero biological proof of their existence and killing innocent people, I'll stop.

Until then, I say FUCK THE APA!!!

How on earth would he know he was gay before puberty? That doesn't mean environment made it so - just that kids normally don't look at the opposite sex like sexual objects until that time.