"Scholar," do you understand the difference between an assertion and something proven?

(June 2, 2013 at 6:14 am)paulpablo Wrote: You have even said in this sentence that time can be set in relation between G1 and G2, It's impossible for you to definitely know that it will. There could still be a G2 existing now outside of G1s time and space and our time and space completely not related to anything.

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Also I'm confused as to this part in what you originally typed.

let's forget about the word time
I'll define a new term "Zime" it is defined as relation between two events
We will apply the same proof then we will find that Zime must have a beginning.
Before Zime existed there can be only one event at a time and from a single source

Quote:Are you saying god was outside of time, then became part of time when he created the world in 6 days or periods, then he went back to not being a part of time up until the point when he had to impregnate virgins and tell noah to build a boat, but after that he went back to not being a part of time again?

No, I'm saying that God's first event (and before) was outside time.
after that any event can be related to time because other events exist.

We are currently measuring time by clock ticks, if there is no clock ticks then we can only measure time by relating it to another event (sun movements for example), Now imagine that there is nothing but on event, time then is meaningless because we cannot relate that event to anything.

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(June 2, 2013 at 6:10 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(June 2, 2013 at 4:34 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: Prophet Mohamed said: Life is the paradise of non-believers and the prison of believers.

Well, then... Leave life to us non-believers and kill yourselves. This paradise will be much more paradisiacal without the likes of you.

Yes, for sure so you can live in denial without proofs that you cannot refute

(June 2, 2013 at 8:31 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: ..."Zime"...

All you guys, you realize that the "Zime" between your birth and your death is a finite set? Maybe just go out and get laid or play the guitar or do somehing else that is meaningful rather than keep on beating the same old dead smelly horse called "God"...

Quote:let's forget about the word time
I'll define a new term "Zime" it is defined as relation between two events
We will apply the same proof then we will find that Zime must have a beginning.
Before Zime existed there can be only one event at a time and from a single source

Ok so without time zime cannot exist, but why does this prove the non existence of G2? Why does G2 have to be related to any events or actions performed by G1?

Instead of time, he now defines a zime...
To go with it, he must have a zuniverse, where the zuman species was created by an entity from outside the zuniverse and outside zime.

And they fail to understand why we think they live in the world of make believe...

(June 2, 2013 at 8:36 am)littleendian Wrote:

(June 2, 2013 at 8:31 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: ..."Zime"...

All you guys, you realize that the "Zime" between your birth and your death is a finite set? Maybe just go out and get laid or play the guitar or do somehing else that is meaningful rather than keep on beating the same old dead smelly horse called "God"...

Zime is like Dog years for you.

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(June 2, 2013 at 8:37 am)paulpablo Wrote:

Quote:let's forget about the word time
I'll define a new term "Zime" it is defined as relation between two events
We will apply the same proof then we will find that Zime must have a beginning.
Before Zime existed there can be only one event at a time and from a single source

Ok so without time zime cannot exist, but why does this prove the non existence of G2? Why does G2 have to be related to any events or actions performed by G1?

It is a hypothesis not a choice

Imagine that you are there, G1 is creating the Universe and G2 exists
You can say that G2 did something or nothing at the time/zime of G1 creating the Universe
Your thoughts means that time/zime exists.

But this impossible as we already proved that Zime didn't exist.
It is a bit mind challenging because we are not used of imagining the non-existence of time/space.

(June 2, 2013 at 8:31 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: Now imagine that there is nothing but one event, time then is meaningless because we cannot relate that event to anything.

Any knowledge of General Relativity will tell you that spacetime exists together with matter. If no matter, then no spacetime. And GR has overwhelming evidence supporting it. What you have in your case is idle speculations which are groundless.

So why does what G1 does have to be related to G2, you can tell me by using zime or time.

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Quote:Imagine that you are there, G1 is creating the Universe and G2 exists
You can say that G2 did something or nothing at the time/zime of G1 creating the Universe
Your thoughts means that time/zime exists.

Ok so just one question, does god exist outside of time at this moment?

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Quote:4. G is outside time, G must be one unit as if there are more than one entity time can be related to each other, but as time did not exist, then G is one UN-separated self-dependent unit
(The Eternal, The one, The self sufficient)

If god isn't outside of time then why did you type this?

(June 2, 2013 at 8:50 am)paulpablo Wrote: Ok so just one question, does god exist outside of time at this moment?

If you mean this (current) moment? God's action are done within time
If you mean at the first event, then time didn't exist then.

Quote:If god isn't outside of time then why did you type this?

Same as above

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(June 2, 2013 at 8:50 am)little_monkey Wrote:

(June 2, 2013 at 8:31 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: Now imagine that there is nothing but one event, time then is meaningless because we cannot relate that event to anything.

Any knowledge of General Relativity will tell you that spacetime exists together with matter. If no matter, then no spacetime. And GR has overwhelming evidence supporting it. What you have in your case is idle speculations which are groundless.

As I mentioned many times, I didn't use the full scientific definition of time
Please replace every occurrence of the word time by Zime in my posts.

I only utilized a subset of the definition which is
1-Consecutive events
2-Related events
If one event E1 is repeated and another event E2 happens then we can say that E2 occurred at time E1(N)
This doesn't require matter or even the universe itself.

(June 4, 2013 at 2:21 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote:

(June 2, 2013 at 8:50 am)paulpablo Wrote: Ok so just one question, does god exist outside of time at this moment?

If you mean this (current) moment? God's action are done within time
If you mean at the first event, then time didn't exist then.

Quote:If god isn't outside of time then why did you type this?

Same as above

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(June 2, 2013 at 8:50 am)little_monkey Wrote: Any knowledge of General Relativity will tell you that spacetime exists together with matter. If no matter, then no spacetime. And GR has overwhelming evidence supporting it. What you have in your case is idle speculations which are groundless.

As I mentioned many times, I didn't use the full scientific definition of time
Please replace every occurrence of the word time by Zime in my posts.

I only utilized a subset of the definition which is
1-Consecutive events
2-Related events
If one event E1 is repeated and another event E2 happens then we can say that E2 occurred at time E1(N)
This doesn't require matter or even the universe itself.

Event implies the existence of time, which implies the existence of space and matter. The universe doesn't work according to your whimsical imagination. Go back to square one. You're totally lost.