(August 27, 2013 at 2:54 pm)Drich Wrote: to descern how to proceed.

To determine if it was a cry for help attempt or did you take a shot gun and blow off half your face, and for some reason you were spared.

Where you trying to quench a void in your heart, or were you seriously trying to meet your maker?

One of my workers just had a son climb up in a tree and properly hang himself on the 17 of this month. this was not his first attempt, he tried 'filling a void' a few times before, but appearently the reaction he got was not great enough, so this time he tied a proper knot and the 30 fall snapped his neck.

i too lost a friend and a close family member to sucide, one did the shot gun thing (but did not survive) and the other when on a hunger and medcine strike for two weeks. Both did not want to live no matter the cost.

I say all of that to say, there is a difference between actually wanting death, and wanting some form of love to the point of dying. If you want to be full filled/loved and you are willing to risk your life to obtain it, then why not give what you have to God, and offer yourself completely? After all you risked death because you could not live how or who you wanted to live. So why not put this determination you have into something that will pay back actual dividens for the rest of eternity?

Well, just as I was about to turn on the car, my dad came home from lunch, and I knew he would stop me if he heard the car running. I sat silently in my car for the 45 minutes that he ate his lunch, and I proceeded when I saw that he had left. When I awoke later to the sudden realization I was alive, I was angrier than I've ever been in my life. I wanted to die, period. I wanted it over. In acutality, it wasn't so much that I wanted to die. It was that I wanted peace, and death was the only method that appeared to be able to give it to me.

And as to offering myself to god, what makes you so certain I haven't tried?

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(August 27, 2013 at 3:03 pm)pineapplebunnybounce Wrote: This is getting as creepy as Mark Dreher.

Or is it just me?

It's not just you, but I have come to expect creepiness from having religious debates with the hardcore. I guess it just doesn't phase me that much anymore.

(August 27, 2013 at 4:11 pm)Faith No More Wrote: And as to offering myself to god, what makes you so certain I haven't tried?

Well, duh, you're an atheist, of course.

(August 27, 2013 at 4:12 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote: Well, duh, you're an atheist, of course.

Of course, CD, but how can I knock 'em down if you won't let me set 'em up?

(August 27, 2013 at 4:14 pm)Faith No More Wrote:

(August 27, 2013 at 4:12 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote: Well, duh, you're an atheist, of course.

Of course, CD, but how can I knock 'em down if you won't let me set 'em up?

Oh, so sorry. Do carry on.

(August 27, 2013 at 4:11 pm)Faith No More Wrote: Well, just as I was about to turn on the car, my dad came home from lunch, and I knew he would stop me if he heard the car running. I sat silently in my car for the 45 minutes that he ate his lunch, and I proceeded when I saw that he had left. When I awoke later to the sudden realization I was alive, I was angrier than I've ever been in my life. I wanted to die, period. I wanted it over. In acutality, it wasn't so much that I wanted to die. It was that I wanted peace, and death was the only method that appeared to be able to give it to me.

Well, I am glad you got a second chance. don't throw it away.

Quote:And as to offering myself to god, what makes you so certain I haven't tried?

Because we've discussed this before. (Unless something has changed since the last time we spoke of this.)

You offered yourself to God on your terms. You would do "x" in exchange for "Y". Which is not 'offering Yourself to God.' You were bartering with God. You can try and brater with God till the cows come Home and the net result will always be the same. To give yourself means just that to give yourself for what God has promised to Give you in return. Nothing more nothing less (john 12)23 Jesus said to them, “The time has come for the Son of Man to receive his glory. 24 It is a fact that a grain of wheat must fall to the ground and die before it can grow and produce much more wheat. If it never dies, it will never be more than a single seed. 25 Whoever loves the life they have now will lose it. But whoever is willing to give up their life in this world will keep it. They will have eternal life. 26 Whoever serves me must follow me. My servants must be with me everywhere I am. My Father will give honor to anyone who serves me.

You gave yourself to the idea that you might find peace in death, Why not be willing to give yourself to God to receive what He has promised. at this point what do you have to loose? a Philosphy of emptiness, and the adoration of those who seek emptiness? Piss on that. why settle for emptiness when there truly is so much more to be had?

Quote:It's not just you, but I have come to expect creepiness from having religious debates with the hardcore. I guess it just doesn't phase me that much anymore.

I am learning to be what people need me to be, (in so far as I am truly able) inorder to help them get to where they are going. If for one person I need to be the 'creepy guy' for ever to everyone here, then may I by the grace of God cherish that role.

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(August 27, 2013 at 4:09 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote:

(August 27, 2013 at 3:39 pm)Drich Wrote: I'll tell you what I told Stimmy. If you want God to 'smite you.' All you have to do is ask Him to do so. I dared God at one point in my life to do that very thing, as a result I got to see the 'gates' of Hell.

(I dared God to show me what the big deal was.) So He did.

You misunderstand my purpose, Drich. I don't want god to smite me. I believe he's wholly incapable of doing so, being nonexistent and all of that.

What I'm asking you to do is demonstrate that he can. You know, since you almost always get what you ask for in prayers, per your own claim. Why would god listen to me? I'm just an unrepentant godless sinner with blasphemy in his heart.

5-6 Then Jesus said to them, “Suppose one of you went to your friend’s house very late at night and said to him, ‘A friend of mine has come into town to visit me. But I have nothing for him to eat. Please give me three loaves of bread.’ 7 Your friend inside the house answers, ‘Go away! Don’t bother me! The door is already locked. My children and I are in bed. I cannot get up and give you the bread now.’ 8 I tell you, maybe friendship is not enough to make him get up to give you the bread. But he will surely get up to give you what you need if you continue to ask. 9 So I tell you, continue to ask, and God will give to you. Continue to search, and you will find. Continue to knock, and the door will open for you. 10 Yes, whoever continues to ask will receive. Whoever continues to look will find. And whoever continues to knock will have the door opened for them. 11 Do any of you have a son? What would you do if your son asked you for a fish? Would any father give him a snake? 12 Or, if he asked for an egg, would you give him a scorpion? Of course not! 13 Even you who are bad know how to give good things to your children. So surely your heavenly Father knows how to give the Holy Spirit to the people who ask him.”

Right, bible quotations. Precisely what I was looking for.

It's not as if I haven't read the fucking thing before.

(August 26, 2013 at 11:10 pm)Drich Wrote: I am saying if you do not think you would ask God to spare your life when face with a terrible disease like aids, I am asking you to allow me to pray that God strike you down with aids, cancer or whatever it takes for you to beg and or grovel for your life. Why?

Me, me! Pray your heart out!

(August 26, 2013 at 11:10 pm)Drich Wrote: To simply prove the point that there are no atheist when you are staring down the barrel of eternity. That is how I know those 'elite controllers' were healed. Because I know they prayed. Even the ones who thought they were atheist.

I've stared down that barrel before, Drich, and inevitably will again. It didn't even occur to me to pray. That's how I know you're full of shit.

(August 26, 2013 at 11:10 pm)Drich Wrote: Not a terrible life. A deadly disease. Or to be put in a life and death situation. There is nothing I am offering to do for you that I have not already prayed for myself. In that, a long time ago I asked God to do whatever it took, even if it meant my life, to help me see and understand Him. I now offer that on your behalf for you. Not as a curse but an opportunity to not only know yourself, but in the journey to get to know God.

I invite you to pray for God to do whatever it takes to get me to believe in him. I'll be happy to keep you posted on the results here.

(August 26, 2013 at 11:10 pm)Drich Wrote: For he who cherishes his life above all else will loose it. And he who forsakes his life for Christ will gain eternal life.

Having been clinically dead for nine hours, while on life support during open heart surgery, I have to say that being dead doesn't arouse much fear in me. I still have things I want to do and I hope I have a peaceful end, but that's about it when it comes to fear of death. Eternal life doesn't sound all that great either when you really think about it. I can't imagine anything that could trivialize my life on earth more than for it to have been a mere prelude to never-ending trillions upon trillions infinitely squared years of after life.

(August 26, 2013 at 11:10 pm)Drich Wrote: Just know I generally get what I pray for.

Best of luck! And could you make it snappy? Me getting a deadly disease in my eighties will be a little hard to connect to your prayer.

“If Peeta and I were both to die, or they thought we were....My fingers fumble with the pouch on my belt, freeing it. Peeta sees it and his hand clamps on my wrist. "No, I won't let you." "Trust me," I whisper. He holds my gaze for a long moment then lets go. I loosen the top of the pouch and pour a few spoonfuls of berries into his palm. Then I fill my own. "On the count of three?" Peeta leans down and kisses me once, very gently. "The count of three," he says. We stand, our backs pressed together, our empty hands locked tight. "Hold them out. I want everyone to see," he says. I spread out my fingers, and the dark berries glisten in the sun. I give Peeta's hand one last squeeze as a signal, as a good-bye, and we begin counting. "One." Maybe I'm wrong. "Two." Maybe they don't care if we both die. "Three!" It's too late to change my mind. I lift my hand to my mouth taking one last look at the world. The berries have just passed my lips when the trumpets begin to blare. The frantic voice of Claudius Templesmith shouts above them. "Stop! Stop! Ladies and gentlemen, I am pleased to present the victors of the 74th Hunger Games, Katniss Everdeen and Peeta Mellark! I give you - the tributes of District 12!”

(August 27, 2013 at 5:27 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: I've stared down that barrel before, Drich, and inevitably will again. It didn't even occur to me to pray. That's how I know you're full of shit.

Apparently you weren't near enough to death, or for long enough.

(August 27, 2013 at 5:34 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote:

(August 27, 2013 at 5:27 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: I've stared down that barrel before, Drich, and inevitably will again. It didn't even occur to me to pray. That's how I know you're full of shit.

Apparently you weren't near enough to death, or for long enough.

What he meant was you were obviously not anywhere close to being brain dead, otherwise like Drich you would pray.