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(April 4, 2014 at 12:20 pm)super spidey man Wrote: How do you explain the start of the big bang? there has to be and unCaused first cause. The beginning of the big bang in a split second threw in the existence of time,laws,matter,physics, everything are universe lives with today. If the sun was to far away from the earth we would freeze to death, If we were to close the sun we would burn up.If the oxygen level wasn't perfect we would either suffocate or have fires everywhere. DNA is extremely complex everything is designed on a razors edge, life demands for a brilliant designer its the only logical way. And in the explosion of the big bang it wasn't just random chaos everything was guided into place, what did you guys think everything just happen to be perfect?? I don't have near enough faith to be an Atheist.
I can't explain the start of the big bang.
I don't know about uncaused first causes I don't understand fully how time and space work. I don't understand how something could be uncaused or how something could cause something else before time was created.
It's true our planet is the best planet for life that we know of, we have fairly detailed knowledge of about 9 planets that exist within our galaxy but that's 9 out of about ten trillion planets in our galaxy alone.
I don't know a great deal about oxygen levels but I'm pretty sure they have increased and decreased over time resulting in the huge insects which used to exist which can't anymore because we have less oxygen now.
So when you say "perfect" oxygen levels, there seems to be some margin of error there on what is perfect because the levels have gone up and down, the same can be said of the distance to the sun from the earth which also fluctuates.
When you talk about DNA and say it's all designed on a razors edge it's kind of the same thing I mentioned in the previous paragraph.
Living things do have deformities and sometimes living things are so badly "designed" as you put it, they are no longer living things but dead things in the ground rotting because of heart problems, lung problems, brain problems, cancer and so on and so on.
Again relating to my previous paragraph, everything isn't just perfect.
Are you ready for the fire? We are firemen. WE ARE FIREMEN! The heat doesn’t bother us. We live in the heat. We train in the heat. It tells us that we’re ready, we’re at home, we’re where we’re supposed to be. Flames don’t intimidate us. What do we do? We control the flame. We control them. We move the flames where we want to. And then we extinguish them.
I knew there were other creator gods, but I didn't know there were that many. I guess there really were a lot of people that weren't satisfied with their deity having control of some aspect of the universe. Their gods created the whole thing.
Poe's Law: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."
(April 4, 2014 at 1:26 pm)Fromper Wrote: Interesting. I'm no expert on this stuff, but as I said, I recently read Hawking's "A Brief History of Time". As I understand what I read there, there is no "edge" to the universe, but I thought the curvature just meant that if you could travel faster than light in one direction, you'd eventually end up back where you started. Also, if you were traveling faster than light, then you'd be traveling 4 dimensions, not just 3, so you could arrive back where you started before you actually left.
But I didn't realize that there would be more out there than we're capable of observing due to light speed limitations.
thats right.
They don't know yet. They are still looking. They aint even sure that those galaxies so far away aint our own milky way 10 billion years ago.
remember they know less than 10% of the stuff out there. Everything we know is a human perceptive only.
The first thing to know is that our solar system is not an original part of the Milky Way. It's actually part of another galaxy (the Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy) that's currently being absorbed by the larger Milky Way. http://viewzone2.com/milkywayx.html
You can see it every night that you are able to look at the stars. The plane of the actual Milky Way Galaxy is tilted. The problem is that people don't always understand what they are looking at.
Poe's Law: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."
(April 5, 2014 at 3:50 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Or solar system was adopted? Interesting.
The Milky Way is actually absorbing a couple of smaller galaxies like our own at this time. In another several billion years the Milky Way and Andromeda will merge. That would be a sight to behold. I'm sure some superstitious creatures will be blabbing about the end times.
(April 5, 2014 at 8:11 am)Alex K Wrote: No, because in the theists mind, with the name god come so many more properties which piggyback their way in on this argument unnoticed. This alternative exposes hiw unjustified those are by doing away with the loaded name God and showing that it still works. Fleems neither have to be sentient, good, allknowing, omnipotent, bearded, there neednt be an afterlife, they don't want anything from us etc.
God has other properties, sure. But the properties that you mentioned are all identical to Gods. So we can call 'fleems' a sub category of God.
You're missing the point. The point is: without granting the theist three unstated assumptions (God exists, God can create universes, and God is eternal), then their argument doesn't prove God. It's a circular argument. They assume those things, use that assumption to prove God was the first cause, then use the existence of the universe to prove God.
All I have to do is take any non-falsifiable thing, give it those three qualities, and I've now proven the same thing to the same degree that they've proven God. I can do that with literally an infinite number of things:
Fleems
Fluums
Wargarble
Unicorns
Almighty Dog
Almighty God
It's not like those things are subsets of God; they just happen to have the three qualities that the theist silently assumes in their "proof".
Also, I don't know why you would think that fleems having those three properties would make them a subset of God. Can you prove God actually has those three qualities? It sounds like you're just making up a definition for God and insisting everyone use it.
There are at least 109 other creator options.
