(November 18, 2014 at 6:31 pm)Heywood Wrote: We should provide universal health care. We can't because the democrats are in bed with big corporations so instead of providing actual health care....they make everyone buy health care insurance. Healthcare insurance is not healthcare.

Well, it's not as if the Republicans wouldn't suck corporate dick even harder.

(November 18, 2014 at 12:17 pm)Parkers Tan Wrote:

(November 18, 2014 at 10:44 am)Heywood Wrote: If he wanted all his citizens to have a hamburgers....the solution involved grilling up some more hamburgers.

Your analogy fails. Doctors aren't eaten. After they treat one patient, they typically go on to treat others.

Healthcare can be had in any city or town in America ... for a fee. The problem is affordability. Insurance companies have made health-care unaffordable, in part because Americans are lawsuit-happy, in part because insurance companies are profit-driven.

Healthcare is consumed just like any other service Parker. Its continually being produced by doctors(and nurses and other health care providers) but also continually being consumed. If demand for it exceeds the amount produced people will have to go with out. We are seeing this starting to happen already.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/06/sunday...-norm.html

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(November 18, 2014 at 6:36 pm)abaris Wrote: Well, it's not as if the Republicans wouldn't suck corporate dick even harder.

Republicans never sucked corporate cock as hard as the democrats did this time. The republicans never passed a law that requires every citizen to purchase the product of their corporate pals. The health insurance companies are getting their cocks sucked off so hard by the democrats right now their dicks are turning green.

LOL, I feel like a broken record. I agree, democrats are in bed with big corporations....and republicans?

(btw, Heywood...I really have to stress the futility of being a republican apologist when you have a conversation with me....I'm not a democrat.......it's wasted effort - all I'll do is lump you in with the both of them as part of the problem, understand?)

Obama admits to liberally stealing ideas from Gruber.





Do you think one of those ideas was decieve the American people to get your bill passed?

I am not a democrat or a republican. I am basically a political atheist and I never vote.

The fact of the matter is that both democrats and republicans are corrupt and horrible at running this country.

(November 18, 2014 at 6:31 pm)Heywood Wrote: We should provide universal health care. We can't because the democrats are in bed with big corporations so instead of providing actual health care....they make everyone buy health care insurance.

So you think the GOP isn't standing in the way of universal health care?

Go to an RNC convention and suggest, "you know, what the GOP really needs to do is reject Obamacare by taking up the cause of replacing it with Medicare-for-All." Be prepared to be laughed out of the room. They don't even like Medicare at all.





The only coherent GOP proposal on health care was Ryan's plan to replace Medicare with a coupon system and wish seniors luck in finding a private health insurance company that will cover them.

(November 18, 2014 at 8:45 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:

(November 18, 2014 at 6:31 pm)Heywood Wrote: We should provide universal health care. We can't because the democrats are in bed with big corporations so instead of providing actual health care....they make everyone buy health care insurance.

So you think the GOP isn't standing in the way of universal health care?

Go to an RNC convention and suggest, "you know, what the GOP really needs to do is reject Obamacare by taking up the cause of replacing it with Medicare-for-All." Be prepared to be laughed out of the room. They don't even like Medicare at all.

The only coherent GOP proposal on health care was Ryan's plan to replace Medicare with a coupon system and wish seniors luck in finding a private health insurance company that will cover them.

I'd get kicked out of a republican convention. They simply wouldn't accept someone espousing the government PRODUCE health care for everyone that wants/needs it. They simply wouldn't accept someone who wants to implement a universal basic income.

I'd get kicked out of a democratic convention. The simply would not accept someone espousing the elimination of a minimum wage. The simply would not accept someone who wants to end all government subsidies to businesses.

I'm a true independent....not one of the nominal ones.

Oh...and seniors would get picked up under Ryan's plan(which is just Obamacare for seniors). Seniors get picked up by Medicare advantage plans now.

(November 18, 2014 at 1:11 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote: Health insurance companies make money when people are denied care. Their ideal business model is to collect premiums every month and never have to provide any health care at all. Yet, we hope that health insurance companies will provide health care to its members?

Yes that's certainly at the crux of the issue. Insurance companies want to rape and pillage. It's the same with banks and the GFC if you remember - banks were knowingly producing bad mortgages, they didn't care because they got paid interest and got to repossess homes through foreclosure.

Quote:No wonder we pay the most and get the least for our healthcare in America.

A lot of it is down to the fact that it isn't regulated properly. I mean pharmaceuticals are to me one of the most obvious ones - why can you buy government subsidised drugs at a goddamn petrol station??

(November 18, 2014 at 10:43 pm)Aractus Wrote: A lot of it is down to the fact that it isn't regulated properly. I mean pharmaceuticals are to me one of the most obvious ones - why can you buy government subsidised drugs at a goddamn petrol station??

Why? America is no longer a democracy, that's why. It hasn't been one for some time. The actual term for our government is "oligarchy" or perhaps "plutocracy".

Those who are wealthy enough can buy our representatives. Those who aren't bribed with campaign contributions can go to work in the private sector with cushy jobs once they've done their service in the government catering to corporate America. Don't worry if you get voted out of office. If you've been a good little Senator or Representative, you'll be rewarded with a soft landing and a nice job somewhere.

The corruption has gotten so bad that it's not even hidden anymore. It's all done in plain sight. Pretty much you know which candidate is bought out by which special interests. They might as well wear corporate decals on their suits as they debate. Voting is often a matter of picking the candidate that has sold out to the interests you're more comfortable with.

Our media is also owned by a few major corporations. No abuse by anyone playing along with the powers that be are ever held to account. At most, if things really get bad and there's enough public outrage, you'll hear the "both sides" narrative played out. Our media will discuss vague things like "how Washington is broken" but no names will ever be dropped and no specifics ever discussed.

I'm a Democrat not because it's a great party or it's not filled to the brim with the spineless and the sell-outs but because the GOP has gone so insane that they have to be voted out of power no matter how bad the only alternative may be. Politics isn't a matter of hoping for anything better anymore but just holding actions against the truly insane from ever getting to the levers of power like they did in the W Bush administration.

No wonder our turnout was only 35% of eligible voters this last election. It's obviously not a good thing. Nothing will get better with the voters staying home. We've got to find a way to rally ourselves for the next one in two years.

(November 18, 2014 at 8:56 pm)Heywood Wrote: I'd get kicked out of a republican convention. They simply wouldn't accept someone espousing the government PRODUCE health care for everyone that wants/needs it. They simply wouldn't accept someone who wants to implement a universal basic income.

I'd get kicked out of a democratic convention. The simply would not accept someone espousing the elimination of a minimum wage. The simply would not accept someone who wants to end all government subsidies to businesses.

I'm a true independent....not one of the nominal ones.

Oh...and seniors would get picked up under Ryan's plan(which is just Obamacare for seniors). Seniors get picked up by Medicare advantage plans now.

You're as much of an independent as Bill O'Reilly.

Just because you don't agree with every policy in the democratic or republican party doesn't mean you lean more to one party than another. From your post and comments, we know exactly which way you lean.