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(July 1, 2015 at 7:57 am)robvalue Wrote: You're totally right. The amount of time some Christians spend demonising homosexuals is entirely disproportionate to what their book says. As I explained, the story of Sodom isn't about homosexuality, so that leaves one puny reference in the middle of the OT (which we don't follow now, remember?). It's mentioned about the same number of times as eating shellfish and wearing clothing weaved from two fabrics.
And even then, this verse can be reasonably interpreted to mean sodomy, but not homosexuality. The Christians involved either can't or won't understand the difference.
Perhaps the reason Christians spend a disproportionate amount of time addressing homosexuality is because the media (movies and television especially) spends a disproportionate amount of time promoting homosexuality.
Considering the fact that less than 5% of the population is actually gay, the percentage of gay characters appearing in television shows and movies is often far more than the 5% number would suggest for realism.
Most movies and tv shows are centered around straight people. They always have been. You notice homosexuals more because you believe that homosexuality is wrong so it stands out to you when you see positive examples of same sex couples.
If movies and tv shows were made to reflect the population than there would be more minorities and women would make up half of the cast in most films.
(July 1, 2015 at 9:41 pm)Nope Wrote: Randy, that verse does not say that god punished Sodom for homosexuality. You are reading into the text. The bible is clear why Sodom was punished.
From Ezekiel 16
Bible god punished the people of Sodom because they didn't help the poor.
Have you actually read Genesis 19 in its entirety?
2 Peter 2:7-8
7 and if he rescued Lot, a righteous man, who was distressed by the depraved conduct of the lawless 8 (for that righteous man, living among them day after day, was tormented in his righteous soul by the lawless deeds he saw and heard)—
"Depraved conduct"? Is that how we normally refer to indifference to the poor?
Sodom's offenses before God were MANY. Homosexuality was only part of the problem.
Your problem is with your holy book not me. Ezekiel plainly states that the people of Sodom didn't help the poor.
(July 1, 2015 at 9:59 pm)Beccs Wrote: None because you KNOW atheists don't accept a claim that a soul exists.
Not relevant.
First, atheists don't accept a claim that God exists, either. Consequently, citing the holocaust, etc. as evidence that God was not cited to anger is meaningless.
Second, if, for the sake of argument, you grant that God DOES exist, then you must also grant that He will behave in God-like ways and not in "Nope-like" ways. IOW, you can't say, "Well, God must not exist because He doesn't act like I want Him to act." If He exists, then He acts in ways that beyond our ways. Which includes being concerned about eternity and not about our fleeting moments on this earth.
So, again, don't argue that God must not exist because He does not act as you, mere human, might act.
Atheists can argue about the motives of a fictional character. I judge god by the bible that his followers claim was inspired by him. Your mythological deity does not act in a way consistent with how he is described. It has nothing to do with how I want him to act.
(July 1, 2015 at 4:21 pm)Nope Wrote: So, the Holocaust, the Black Plague, the Great Famine in Ireland, the Armenian Genocide and any number of horrible events did not anger your god enough to return to earth. Yet the fact that two men can legally marry is the tipping point that makes him want to destroy a large portion of humankind?
Holocaust
Black Plague
Great Famine
Armenian Genocice
etc
All horrible events to be sure.
Tell me, nope, which of these things - which produced great suffering - would automatically endanger the immortal soul of one caught up in it?
So, your god doesn't give a damn about human suffering or children dying as long as two women don't go down on each other? Really? I think that we have solved the question as to whether your deity is good or evil.
(July 1, 2015 at 10:15 pm)Godschild Wrote: I'm the one who remembers it very well and was actually waiting for someone to make this mistake, I knew sooner or later someone who didn't know the scriptures would stumble over their own pride.
Hey, do you think you could try making one post without all this grandstanding? It reads like wishful thinking.
Quote: Pharaoh refused many times on his own accord, God gave him the chance to do as God asked but he thought being a god himself he could defy the only true God. When Pharaoh got to this point God did harden his heart to teach him who this God he was trying to defy really was. You can be assured God's power will be shown again and those who have defied Him will understand what Pharaoh went through.
GC
Pharaoh "defied" god exactly once without god directly intervening to make it so, when two random assholes barged their way into his house and were like "yo, our god is totally real, we have no proof, but he says to do what we say, so do it!" Quite understandably, Pharaoh asked who that god was, which any reasonable person would respond to by providing evidence that what they're saying is true. Instead, Moses and his brother did no such thing; essentially what you're saying is that Pharaoh should have just accepted the word of two complete strangers, making a ridiculous claim with no evidence, at face value.
Gee, no wonder you're a christian if that's the way you think.
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee
Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
(June 30, 2015 at 11:55 pm)Cinjin Wrote: Dear Christians,
The god of the bible has promised, without disclaimer, to grant any request made to him by his followers. Millions of Christians prayed while protesting on court steps all over the US for their god to prevent the legalization of gay marriage. No help. Nine devout parishioners in a bible study were gunned down by a racist in their own “house of god.” Was god there for them? No help. Leave prayer in our schools. No help. Leave the bible in our courtrooms. No help. Millions of innocent children stricken with Cancer. No help. Protect our church in this recent rash of tornados. No help. On and on and on it goes. The pleas and desperate prayers of Christians just keep going unheard and unanswered.
Well Christians, perhaps it isn’t that your god doesn’t like us – it’s that he doesn’t like you…
Hmmm, maybe your god doesn’t appreciate you muddying his name with the myriad of headlines that contain the reprehensible nature of "god-serving citizens." These are taken word for word from recent news stories:
“Protesters of same-sex marriage were also there, calling others in the crowd perverts”…“Many of the protesters against same-sex marriage were not subtle, shouting and carrying signs such as “Fags are Beasts.”” "I saw you there (at the rally) on the side of the children of darkness. Christ is coming soon. Please don't be lost. The fires of Hell are real." “it actually says in Leviticus 20:13 that if a man also lie with mankind as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination, they shall surely be put to death, their blood shall be upon them," said Anderson in the just over one-hour session. Prior to that, he had argued that women who wear mini-skirts were dressing like "whores" and that it was inappropriate for women to wear pants.” “Council of Conservative Citizens a Christian hate group that routinely denigrates blacks as “genetically inferior,” complains about “Jewish power brokers,” calls homosexuals “perverted sodomites,” accuses immigrants of turning America into a “slimy brown mass of glop,” “a Christian lawyer living in California has proposed that the state start executing all gay people with bullets to the head.”
“A gay Tennessee couple was reportedly attacked — physically and verbally assaulted — by a Christian Pastor and his deacons to prevent the same-sex couple from entering the Pastor’s church. Sadly, the pastor is the father of one of the two members of the gay couple. Also sadly, the church members and bystanders did not lift a finger to help the couple or to stop church leaders from perpetrating the crime. Further, initially, local authorities refused to allow the couple to file charges.” “Campus Crusade for Christ—now rebranded, ludicrously, as “Cru”—is a massive organization, and involved in some of the meanest homophobia-for-export in Africa.”
These are real legit stories. There are thousands upon thousands of these sorts of stories all over the world. Christians doing horrible things to anyone and everyone they disagree with and using your precious god as the almighty justification to be ignorant violent bigots. Maybe you can’t catch a break any more because your god is just really sick of you. Don’t get me wrong, I think he’s nothing more than the ink and paper machinations of primitive tent dwellers, but if you really believe he’s real, I think you should seriously consider that he just really can’t stand any of you. Consider it, don’t consider it … it doesn’t matter. Your religion is dying and it seems obvious to me that you Christians are the biggest reason for it's inevitable demise. 200 years from now, you will be a joke, and any remaining zealots will be a fringe cult that even your great great grand children will long to be rid of. Ever Sincerely,
A Rational Reasonable Human Being
Hitchen ask this question which gets down to brass tacks: “Why would you want there not to be a God“? And the answer is a good one. What it does is strips away the intellectual veneer that many atheist try to wrap themselves in, trying to give the impression they have problems with the evidence to obfuscate their real reason. His answer to the question is spot on. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnIH4gomOqc
Atheist Credo: A universe by chance that also just happened to admit the observer by chance.
July 2, 2015 at 12:48 am (This post was last modified: July 2, 2015 at 12:48 am by Whateverist.)
(July 1, 2015 at 9:33 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: Bonus Question
Q: Why did God utterly destroy the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah?
A: Because He is righteous and holy and just. The sins of those cities cried out to heaven for punishment.
Not sure which is worse: the self serving assumption on your part that the smiting of S & G was just, despite your lack of any direct evidence -or- the thought of all the horrible things we've lived through since which apparently God was just fine with. Throw six million jews in the ovens. No problem. Pol Pot and Stalin, can't be bothered.
(July 2, 2015 at 12:30 am)snowtracks Wrote: Hitchen ask this question which gets down to brass tacks: “Why would you want there not to be a God“? And the answer is a good one. What it does is strips away the intellectual veneer that many atheist try to wrap themselves in, trying to give the impression they have problems with the evidence to obfuscate their real reason. His answer to the question is spot on.
So essentially you can't argue the actual evidence and so turn to the despicable tactics of conmen everywhere and attempt to impugn the motivations of those who dare disagree with you, as though if you simply assert based on nothing that malevolent motivations exist, you've disqualified them from being allowed to disagree; but since you never bother to actually demonstrate that, it's mindless pablum designed to make you feel better about the utter failure of your position.
"If you disagree with me, there's something wrong with you," is a vile and childish epithet vaunted by know-nothing egotists with no hope of arguing their position and no respect for other people or themselves.
Kindly go fuck yourself.
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee
Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
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