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Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 11:25 am
(This post was last modified: August 6, 2009 at 11:34 am by FaithAffirmed.)
Hello everyone, I'm introducing myself, I did write a bit of a plug previously but I'm editing such so that I may be respectful and introduce myself. I'm an atheist however, I have the utmost respect for the religious beliefs. Actually my respect is better placed in those who have Faith. Faith in my eyes is one of the most powerful tools accessible to a person. And while I may not have faith in God, I can't help but be amazed by those who do. I don't look to take away such a tool and in fact can't help but encourage it. However, my qualms with God and religions is when they attempt to enter the public or scientific sphere claiming false evidence and ignoring up to date facts. Anywho, thats who I am and thats what I'm about.
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 1:08 pm
Welcome to the forums!
Personally, it's not God I dislike, it's his fan club I can't stand.
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 1:49 pm
Appreciate the welcome Overmars, digging the avatar!
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 3:14 pm
What faith "empowers" people to do is, I admit, sometimes impressive (I'm often near blown away by some religiously inspired artwork and architecture) but also scary as hell ... to me it comes down to what Dawkins says, something like, "good people do good things, bad people do bad things, but it takes a religion to make good people do bad things"! Personally I think it should be widened to ideology and acknowledge that religion can make bad people do good things but it still scares the hell outta me ... no gods will ever scare me, their followers do!
Kyu
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 4:59 pm
Welcome to the forums FaithAffirmed.
I gotta warn you though - "Faith" is my nemesis!
That's not a joke just because of my name by the way. I'm serious. Faith is just irrational, gratuitous nonsense that can also lead to a lot of harm, as far as I'm concerned.
EvF
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 5:05 pm
(This post was last modified: August 6, 2009 at 5:08 pm by FaithAffirmed.)
(August 6, 2009 at 3:14 pm)Kyuuketsuki Wrote: What faith "empowers" people to do is, I admit, sometimes impressive (I'm often near blown away by some religiously inspired artwork and architecture) but also scary as hell ... to me it comes down to what Dawkins says, something like, "good people do good things, bad people do bad things, but it takes a religion to make good people do bad things"! Personally I think it should be widened to ideology and acknowledge that religion can make bad people do good things but it still scares the hell outta me ... no gods will ever scare me, their followers do!
Kyu
Always take the question and flip it before you ask it. As you quoted "...it takes a religion to make good people do bad things." There are countless examples of religion taking bad people and making them do good things. In fact one of the strongest buffers against addictions and many already requiring recovery is religion. Buffers like religion provide the much needed yet hardly understood resilience that people have when it comes to addiction and deviant behavior in the psychological field. So faith can be seen as an idea and as Lawrence Kaplow wrote "...information is incapable of harm in of itself, ideas are neither good nor bad but merely as useful as what we do with them. Only actions can cause harm."
(August 6, 2009 at 4:59 pm)EvidenceVsFaith Wrote: Welcome to the forums FaithAffirmed.
I gotta warn you though - "Faith" is my nemesis!
That's not a joke just because of my name by the way. I'm serious. Faith is just irrational, gratuitous nonsense that can also lead to a lot of harm, as far as I'm concerned.
EvF
Theres no denying Faith can cause harm. A belief in anything can cause harm. A belief in science is a major component during the gruesome Nazi experiments performed. I don't ask that you believe in the faith but that you RESPECT the faith. Faith is such a tool that none of us can even comprehend. But in our lack of comprehension we then condemn it, which is the same thing that causes Crazy Conservative Christians to picket against homosexuals. When we don't hold respect for beliefs that aren't our own, we become ignorant ourselves.
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 5:09 pm
Yes, it's certaintly a very 'popular' placebo, but a I don't think it's the best one! A better one would be...basically any that can't lead you to killing in the name of something - such as a non-existent deity!
EvF
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 5:18 pm
(August 6, 2009 at 5:05 pm)FaithAffirmed Wrote: (August 6, 2009 at 3:14 pm)Kyuuketsuki Wrote: to me it comes down to what Dawkins says, something like, "good people do good things, bad people do bad things, but it takes a religion to make good people do bad things"! Personally I think it should be widened to ideology and acknowledge that religion can make bad people do good things but it still scares the hell outta me ... no gods will ever scare me, their followers do!
Always take the question and flip it before you ask it. As you quoted "...it takes a religion to make good people do bad things." There are countless examples of religion taking bad people and making them do good things.
Not trying to be funny mate but did you actually read what I wrote? I already said that bit, the bit you appeared critical of!
Kyu
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 5:18 pm
(August 6, 2009 at 5:09 pm)EvidenceVsFaith Wrote: Yes, it's certaintly a very 'popular' placebo, but a I don't think it's the best one! A better one would be...basically any that can't lead you to killing in the name of something - such as a non-existent deity!
EvF
But theres NO belief that won't lead you to killing. Because killing isn't inherently about the belief so much as it is about the person. The people who would kill for God just happen to kill for God. Had they been environmentalist they would have killed for nature. Had they been cheese enthusiast they would kill for cheese. The fact of the matter is that the killers will kill because thats who they are. So we can't judge the faith based on the killers the same way that, although I'm a massive animal enthusiast, I'd rather not be judged based on the terrorist actions of the Animal Liberation Front or PETA.
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RE: Atheismix
August 6, 2009 at 5:26 pm
Sorry but I can't imagine 911 just as likely being caused by cheese enthusiasts mate. I think the belief certainly matters.
And I don't know if you've noticed, but yes - there are a lot of other ideologies that people have killed under. But religion is a big one! Dying for a supreme being, especially when you're expecting to go to a martyrs heaven for doing so - is quite a motivator if you so strongly believe it! I wouldn't expect the same from cheese enthusiasts to be honest. I don't see it as impossible but... - not exactly as likely!
EvF
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