Perfection!

[TruthWorthy]

True, true :laughter:

[Purple Rabbit]

There is no such thing as a wrong direction in evolution. There is no intrinsic flaw in nature, nature just is. The idea of flaw is an entirely human one. It may express an ethical or esthetical judgement or a shortcoming in the model of nature as made by man. If nature gives unexpected results it's not because nature has flaws, but because our model of nature has flaws.

Based off Fr0d0's post this just had to be done

There is no such thing as a wrong direction in Faith. There is no intrinsic flaw in God, God just is. The idea of flaw is an entirely human one. It may express an ethical or esthetical judgement or a shortcoming in the idea of God as made by man. If God gives unexpected results it's not because God has flaws, but because our model of God has flaws.

I like your response tackattack, and it had occurred to me when I wrote down my sentences that this one might come. A pitty of the first sentence though, why insert faith instead of god? The problem with your version is of course that it is a skyhook construction: you assume that god IS, where nature is verifiable all around is.

If you make the assumption god = nature your word use resembles that of Einstein. But there is a big difference with most religious takes in that Einstein was horrified by the idea that god is a personal god.

[Edwardo Piet]

I know of no evidence whatsoever for the existence of so-called 'perfection' in an objective or absolute sense... it is just a value (like all other values) made up by humans as far as I'm concerned.

EvF

[Purple Rabbit]

One day that model of nature will be useless and a new model will have to be invented.

Useless as in Newtonian Mechanics as used in rocket science till this very day?

[fr0d0]

If you make the assumption god = nature your word use resembles that of Einstein. But there is a big difference with most religious takes in that Einstein was horrified by the idea that god is a personal god.

We're not talking about the whole of God here, just an aspect. And this aspect is what is attacked as bad when the word 'nature' is substituted for 'God'.

[Purple Rabbit]

If you make the assumption god = nature your word use resembles that of Einstein. But there is a big difference with most religious takes in that Einstein was horrified by the idea that god is a personal god.

We're not talking about the whole of God here, just an aspect. And this aspect is what is attacked as bad when the word 'nature' is substituted for 'God'.

What other aspects are there to complete an already perfect being?

[KichigaiNeko]

One day that model of nature will be useless and a new model will have to be invented.

Just when you think you have a handle on Nature She will always come up with something new ...just to piss you off!!
We don't have to wait for "one day" happens every bloody day of the week!!

She's a real Mother!!

[Purple Rabbit]

I know of no evidence whatsoever for the existence of so-called 'perfection' in an objective or absolute sense... it is just a value (like all other values) made up by humans as far as I'm concerned.

EvF

It's completely irrelevant that you don't know of such evidence. Not knowing does not constitute argument.

[Purple Rabbit]

Perfection is a word.

"Truth cannot be out there—cannot exist independently of the human mind—because sentences cannot so exist, or be out there. The world is out there, but descriptions of the world are not. Only descriptions of the world can be true or false. The world on its own—unaided by the describing activities of humans—cannot.” Richard Rorty in Contingency, irony, and solidarity

[Rhizomorph13]

"Nothing is true, everything is permitted" - Hassan-I Sabbah Leader of the Hashshashin