Thunderf00t vs. Feminism

[Brakeman]

I think Thunderfoot has been simply aghast at some of the poor reasoning skills of particular feminist divas. I have watched several of his videos and I don't see him coming off as misogynistic or macho at all. I think his logic OCD is triggered by their incongruities and his counters have been taken as a grave offense by the feminist guard, especially PZ Meyers who refuses to be academic about the issue despite his own professorship. They have been going tit for tat for a year now..

[Little lunch]

Personally, I think that sexism comes from multiple facets of society and Tf goes a little to far out of his way to defend some of them.

Most male gamers I've met are just as sexist as any other man in society.
A lot of men see feminism as an attack on men.
Most feminists feel it is a defence against men who have been attacking women physically and emotionally forever.

[Brakeman]

Personally, I think that sexism comes from multiple facets of society and Tf goes a little to far out of his way to defend some of them.

He "defends" men only by pointing out poorly reasoned attacks and claims by particular feminists. So it appears that you are claiming that he shouldn't recognize the logical fallacies spouted by the likes of Anita S. because, well, "don't pick on the girl's logic because it's not chivalrous?"

[DramaQueen]

In Libya many men protest the possibility of letting women get divorce without the permission of men.
I think we can call it an exclusive right

[Endo]

In Libya many men protest the possibility of letting women get divorce without the permission of men.
I think we can call it an exclusive right

Yes, a second or third world country that subscribes to a highly oppressive belief set. Something tells me that A bit of Third-wave Feminism isn't going to do a whole lot there. As if it could do much anywhere.

[DeistPaladin]

In advance, please pardon me if I don't seem entirely coherent. I'm still recovering from a horrible flu that took me down for several days.

Who do you think is right in Thunderf00t's ongoing war against feminism, him or the feminists he criticizes?

He paints an entire movement with a broad brush. "Feminism" covers a large area. He seems to take a few dishonest and/or radical individuals and then uses that to condemn a whole movement. It's why I've unsubscribed to his channel.

I think we really should emphasize that point, that "feminism" means different things to different people. So if you ask me who's right, I would answer, it depends.

If your idea of feminism is that women deserve equal pay for equal work, equal job opportunities and equal treatment in society, I'm definitely a feminist.

If your idea of feminism is that we need to do a much better job of educating people about and punishing sexually predatory behaviors like stalking, harassment, domestic violence and rape, I'm a certainly feminist.

If your idea of feminism is that men shouldn't like sex so much and shouldn't like looking at pictures of young, beautiful, scantily clad women, I'll be polite and say that feminism should review that famous Serenity Prayer (ignore the woo).

So I think Tf has some valid points and if he'd concentrated his videos on the subject to constructive criticism of feminism's critique of gaming and certain individuals as individuals and not representatives of an entire movement, that would be one thing. He paints with way to broad a brush. What finally did it for me is when he tried to argue against the common sense "no means no", ala Rush Limbaugh.

[CapnAwesome]

I know some feminists who are rad and some that suck. That's pretty much the same with every group. I was wondering something though, because the two most outspoken feminists I am friends with also have the habit of dating real assholes. Now a sample size of two doesn't really tell you anything. Anybody else notice this trend in their real life friends?

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If your idea of feminism is that women deserve equal pay for equal work, equal job opportunities and equal treatment in society, I'm definitely a feminist.

If your idea of feminism is that we need to do a much better job of educating people about and punishing sexually predatory behaviors like stalking, harassment, domestic violence and rape, I'm a certainly feminist.

If your idea of feminism is that men shouldn't like sex so much and shouldn't like looking at pictures of young, beautiful, scantily clad women, I'll be polite and say that feminism should review that famous Serenity Prayer (ignore the woo).

I am totally with you on all of that except maybe the thing about being polite.

[Alex K]

I was wondering something though, because the two most outspoken feminists I am friends with also have the habit of dating real assholes. Now a sample size of two doesn't really tell you anything. Anybody else notice this trend in their real life friends?

I tend to date (and occasionally marry) feminists. Pray tell, what does that say about myself?

[DeistPaladin]

I was wondering something though, because the two most outspoken feminists I am friends with also have the habit of dating real assholes. Now a sample size of two doesn't really tell you anything. Anybody else notice this trend in their real life friends?

Not personally. My wife had some bad relationships prior to me but more out of self-esteem issues she had at the time than her feminism. Other outspoken feminists I've known seemed happy with their partners.

It may be the small sample you know have a "victim mentality" streak in them. Victim conscious self-pity is not inherent in feminism but would be potentially compatible. Perhaps they pick men who fulfill their expectations and then use their experience to justify what they believe?

Just a shot in the dark.

Generally speaking, when we notice we get into the same relationships over and over, there's a reason.

[FatAndFaithless]

I was wondering something though, because the two most outspoken feminists I am friends with also have the habit of dating real assholes. Now a sample size of two doesn't really tell you anything. Anybody else notice this trend in their real life friends?

Not personally. My wife had some bad relationships prior to me but more out of self-esteem issues she had at the time than her feminism. Other outspoken feminists I've known seemed happy with their partners.

It may be the small sample you know have a "victim mentality" streak in them. Victim conscious self-pity is not inherent in feminism but would be potentially compatible. Perhaps they pick men who fulfill their expectations and then use their experience to justify what they believe?

Just a shot in the dark.

Generally speaking, when we notice we get into the same relationships over and over, there's a reason.

Or hell, the fact that they've dated assholic guys might have contributed to their outspoken feminism.