(September 1, 2015 at 10:16 pm)Esquilax Wrote:As usual, Esquilax, you offer up dishonest and diversionary debate points. Apparently doing so satisfies some need you have for self-righteous anger and belief in your own moral superiority.(September 1, 2015 at 9:14 am)ChadWooters Wrote: The OP gives us a good example of atheist wishful thinking. If there is no god you can do as you please to serve yourself without having to worry about trivialities like justice or truth. You live, you die, the end. How comforting it must feel not having to worry about the ultimate consequences of your life and never being held into account. I can see the appeal of atheism for people with no sense of responsibility beyond themselves.The difference between atheists and theists, it seems, based on the fact that this argument is such a common theme among religious blowhards that can't leave well enough alone, is that atheists don't share in the theist's desire to commit actions that would require accountability of a negative sort after death. Isn't it interesting, Chad, that you seem to believe that your actions in this life will require some retributive justice in the next, whereas I do not? My actions in life don't require some grand, dramatic court martial to balance the books punitively before I go on to my rest, and frankly, it's a testament to how bad you have been not only that you think your actions do require that, but that you literally can't imagine a person who might just be decent their whole lives, make up for their errors in this life, and die without this clawing fear of ultimate justice round the corner. As usual, your projection says far more about you, than it does about that which you disdain.
Incidentally, who, exactly, is attempting to escape accountability here? The atheist, who does their best to make up for their bad actions in the here and now, or the christian, who has shopped off any need to do that on the suffering of a third party they've agreed to be innocent? You want to talk about escaping accountability? You think you're going to heaven regardless of your sins because of a Christ shaped loophole, something that we atheists have no assurance of at all, and you're accusing the people who aren't using the loophole of trying to avoid accountability?
The Christian position is not, as you say, that people require the threat of after-death retribution to behave morally; but rather, that God gives the justice that is conspicuously absent during our mortal term. Christians are called to manifest in their words and deeds love of the Lord and to others as themselves. Love, not fear, is the basis of Christian morality.
You claim not to need a divine threat as an incentive to behave morally. That may be. But that was not my point which was this; just as believers can take comfort in God’s justice and mercy, atheists can take comfort in the idea that they are not bound by any divine or natural law. This gives them license to conform morality to their personal opinions and proclivities, which is what you, Esquilax and others, do.
With respect to your mean-spirited accusation that Christians avoid responsibility, it is true that some Christians mistakenly believe that they can sin and not be held accountable if they ask for forgiveness. That is not sound doctrine (Scriptural references provided upon request). Christ’s forgiveness is not a “Get-Out-of-Hell-Free” card. First there must be true repentance before God extends Mercy. Even our earthly justice system recognizes that the severity of the sentence is tempered by the convict’s contrition. Once forgiveness has been granted the believer must persist in their regeneration. It is Christ’s victory that allows us to overcome, something not available to unbelievers who rely on their own strength and willpower. And it is He who provides the full restitution that no mortal, on his own, has power to give.